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Black Streak
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« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2015, 09:07:33 pm » |
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Black Streak...I like what you said...sounds like you are well educated to what you like in a dog as well as how you hunt...
You said...To me, an all around hog dog should to do it all. Find and catch
That sounds great and really if you catch hogs each time you go out or almost every hog your dogs start then I will have to agree with you...
I do have a question for you...if you turn out in a 5000 acre ranch that does not have many hogs and is mostly wooded...will your dogs pick up an older track and work it until they find and catch a hog? do you have the confidence that a hog will be found? 5000 acres is a huge piece of land...
it seems to me there is no such thing as an all around hog dog on account of many different terrains and situations...
Believe me I did try to breed all around hog dogs and I was very happy with them but they didn't catch all the hogs we started due to several reasons...I thought about adding pitbull but couldn't bring my self to do it on account I didn't want to lose what I hand gained...also thought about super gritty coyote hound of the run to catch type just to add a little more track speed...I could take out 1 or 2 dogs and stop more hogs sooner than with 4 or 5...most places are thick places to hunt...just want your thoughts and if you don't mind if you would give more detail on what you believe is the all around hog dog...
to me an all around hog dog does not mean a dog that catches every hog he starts but one that can have an all around nose for winding, ranging and being able to take a decent track...have enough range to hunt out, have plenty of bottom if needed...I want all I mentioned but also to include what you said...that would be the all around hog dog...catching smart like you mentioned is part of being a good hog dog...but my experience is that sometimes these dogs get caught between a hog and another dog, a fallen log or in between a dry creek bank and the hog and so they can get wrecked...I now run vests on my dogs full time whether it is swimming in the river or 98 degrees with high humidity...
again...not knocking anything you said...just want to know if your dogs can do the other things I consider to be the all around hog dog...
My finder holders hunt in my opinion like an average cur when it comes to scent trailing. To me the scent trailing specialists are the hounds. I appreciate the question but the answere would have to be a generalized no in regards to the cold track. Scent hounds would be better suited for a cold track. I am a hunter, bow and gun. Love the bow! I grew up on a 20,000 cattle ranch here in north central Texas. My passion was hunting. I loved to walk around and hunt as a very young kid. I'd be gone with my bb gun for hours shooting birds in the pastures. From there i got my spot and stalk style and hunted up pigs with a rifle. Then I turned to a bow and really had fun walking and stalking them. I never really thought about it back then but I didn't walk around randemly. I learned my prey and where they liked to be and why. The more familar I got with feral pigs the more successful I was at finding them and killing them. I hunt with my dogs in the same manner I do with a bow in my hand. I'm still hunting the pigs, and my dogs are my hunting buddies but the dogs are also my bow now. My dogs hunt and don't rely on me to show them pigs but you kinds get where I'm going with my hunting style I hope. Me and my dogs are a very good team and well paired with our hunting style. We make one another's job very easy and effective. They hunt like a cur so with the both of us hunting or the 3 of us, yes I feelcconfident I can catch pigs in the 5000 acres. I personally would not expect to cover the entire 5000 acres before getting on pigs because I plan on approaching it a little smarter than just making tracks around the place. With the exception of my stag and my pit, my dogs are of a 15 or 16 year line of finder holders. They ain't just random dogs that I've made work for me for what it's worth. They are pretty skilled well bred pig dogs in their own right! |
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Reuben
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« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2015, 10:08:02 pm » |
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yes...I can see your style is being a great and fun way to hunt...
I grew up hunting with dogs...slingshot, bb gun, spear, then a 22...and of course deer rifles etc as I got older...I also learned the way of the wildlife by hunting dry conditions and very wet conditions...I could and would be soaking wet but I knew exactly where to go to find deer or any kind of game...We didn't have hogs back then where I grew up...My dogs ate what we caught...I learned to stalk and sneak and my dogs would operate off of my signals and a few little hisses here and there if I wanted their attention...if we were stalking and wanted to give a signal I hissed just loud enough to get their attention...I knew when they were running deer or jack rabbit...rabbit...or having a big snapping turtle or big snake bayed...or coon or feral cat treed...you run the dogs enough and you will learn quite a bit about dogs...when I stepped off in the brush alone with my dogs I became a predator...the pack leader...
I speared lots of rabbits the dogs didn't catch that made it to the rose hedges before the dogs had a chance to catch them...
also shot many in the head with the slingshot...when I got a little older about 12 or so I started shooting them ahead of the dogs while on the run with the 22 auto...
one day I was at deer camp deep in South Texas and this ole boy about my age was telling how him and his 2 friends would leave all day into the woods and only take some salt, matches and a knife and come back late in the evening...he switched gears before my eyes as he was showing me how they stalked around...once I saw him I told him he didn't need to say no more...because I then knew what he was...
when I hunted alone with my dogs was not how I hunted when I had another person hunting with me...more because they would not understand...a kid can do way more with a dog than a man can...
a good pack of dogs can look great with the right handling...
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Training dogs is not about quantity, it's more about timing, the right situations, and proper guidance...After that it's up to the dog...
A hunting dog is born not made...
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Black Streak
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« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2015, 11:06:26 pm » |
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yes...I can see your style is being a great and fun way to hunt...
I grew up hunting with dogs...slingshot, bb gun, spear, then a 22...and of course deer rifles etc as I got older...I also learned the way of the wildlife by hunting dry conditions and very wet conditions...I could and would be soaking wet but I knew exactly where to go to find deer or any kind of game...We didn't have hogs back then where I grew up...My dogs ate what we caught...I learned to stalk and sneak and my dogs would operate off of my signals and a few little hisses here and there if I wanted their attention...if we were stalking and wanted to give a signal I hissed just loud enough to get their attention...I knew when they were running deer or jack rabbit...rabbit...or having a big snapping turtle or big snake bayed...or coon or feral cat treed...you run the dogs enough and you will learn quite a bit about dogs...when I stepped off in the brush alone with my dogs I became a predator...the pack leader...
I speared lots of rabbits the dogs didn't catch that made it to the rose hedges before the dogs had a chance to catch them...
also shot many in the head with the slingshot...when I got a little older about 12 or so I started shooting them ahead of the dogs while on the run with the 22 auto...
one day I was at deer camp deep in South Texas and this ole boy about my age was telling how him and his 2 friends would leave all day into the woods and only take some salt, matches and a knife and come back late in the evening...he switched gears before my eyes as he was showing me how they stalked around...once I saw him I told him he didn't need to say no more...because I then knew what he was...
when I hunted alone with my dogs was not how I hunted when I had another person hunting with me...more because they would not understand...a kid can do way more with a dog than a man can...
a good pack of dogs can look great with the right handling...
Yes i get exactly what you describe when hunting alone vs with someone. I am very different when hunting alone and I like it that way but I also love sharing the outdoors with friends. I've learned to just enjoy the outdoors with them and not get caught up in ruining the shared experience with my own particular way I go about things when by myself. I believe a lot of dogs will do better with some people than others. My dogs might seem like rock stars to some when my dogs are with me but if they was someones else's dogs they might think they was pot lickers. Regardless of that, my opinion of an all around hog dog should be able to find pigs and catch them on a consistent basis without getting cut up much at all. My finder holders are can work as stags on crop feilds just as good or better than stags can, the can hunt the woods like curs, rig like curs off a buggy, you can use them as a lead in cd if you so choosed, they pretty much are just all around pig dogs. A good cold trailing dry ground scent hunt is a specialty they can not by no means match, but hey can that cold trailing scent hound catch and hold the pigs he finds or is he a specialist all his own? |
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Judge peel
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« Reply #23 on: October 03, 2015, 07:52:00 am » |
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Black streak I like what you said good stuff. I would much rather have a dog like you stated then a cold tracking dog
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Bo Pugh
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« Reply #24 on: October 04, 2015, 08:49:41 pm » |
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If I was hunting a place with big fields and could go see hogs in it or just ride around and see hogs in roads and such id like me 2 or 3 dogs that don't bark and just catch and not run one all day cause it's some more in the next field over. But where I hunt and how I hunt I load 3 or 4 in my fourwhweler box and ride until i see something I like and depending on which dogs I have turn loose or not. If I have pups or I'm with someone and they want to turn loose on the first bit of sign we see it's fine with me but if I'm by myself or with certain buddy's we like to pass up on little hogs and try to find something a little better to run. I try to leave one dog in the box and sometimes I get carried away and put them all on the track but I try to leave one in the box to pack in later on if one falls out of the race or splits off etc. i like to watch the garmin as they trail it and work out the track then get it jumped and go to where they cross a road and look and see if it's the same track I turned on. And most of the time I really enjoy for them to run it awhile a couple hours is usually fine with me I guess I like for them to have to work a little harder and I don't care about catching a pile of hogs when I go as long as I get on a good track and a good race I'm happy especially when I have some young dogs and they take the lead in the race or cast good. And I don't get in a hurry going to them bayed I try to take my time and usually it takes me a little while to get their anyway so I don't expect them to run 2 or 3 miles then come back they better keep on.
That's just how I like to hunt and what I like and expect in dogs and I'll lead in my bulldog if I can or cut him loose from the fourwhweler and drive in to him as quick as I can unless I hear some squealing. It's just like anything else you have to adapt to what you got and where you hunt
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Reuben
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« Reply #25 on: October 04, 2015, 09:29:33 pm » |
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Black streak I like what you said good stuff. I would much rather have a dog like you stated then a cold tracking dog
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JP...I would like that as well...but I want dogs that will ride and turn them in to catch...but then I would like to add everything else I like to the same dog...no cold cold trailing but being able to find game quickly and shut it down in a short amount of time...if not then run him for as long as it takes to stop him...and hopefully catch him in less than 1 hour...but the concern is if the dogs are that catchy and it takes me an hour to get to them...I will have overheated dogs or worse...unless they are smart about catching...but my first love is dogs that hunt, trail and wind...and make it look easy finding hogs...and catching hogs is the icing on the cake... |
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Training dogs is not about quantity, it's more about timing, the right situations, and proper guidance...After that it's up to the dog...
A hunting dog is born not made...
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Judge peel
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« Reply #26 on: October 04, 2015, 10:47:48 pm » |
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Speed off the track or wind is the main thing with enough grit to turn the hog. If not your just following the hog until it decides to stop
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Reuben
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« Reply #27 on: October 05, 2015, 05:10:48 am » |
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enough grit to turn the hog. If not your just following the hog until it decides to stop
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I have seen this in a few of my dogs in the past... |
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Training dogs is not about quantity, it's more about timing, the right situations, and proper guidance...After that it's up to the dog...
A hunting dog is born not made...
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oconee
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« Reply #28 on: October 05, 2015, 06:51:01 am » |
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Bo Pugh you and hunt just alike! I understand your thought process completely!
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