EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

    Have recently attempted to breed to mature females that are not too old. Put both of them "at separate times" up when swollen and bleeding, tried them every other day with an aggressive breeding dog and they never did flag nor stand, and continued to fight the dog. One of the females has raised 2 litters and was no problem to breed, the other has raised 1 litter and was a bit grouchy the whole way through but I could hold her until contact was made and everything was fine. There has been no change in the keep here in years, it has me scratching my head but I guess maybe unbeknownst to me I just don't need those crosses, haha.

 I know it's a reach, but all I could imagine is that due to the heat and drought they may had already backed off the estrogen and bumped up the progesterone way early in the cycle, making what would normally be the right time to breed, too late.

That’s a weird one for sure. Are you trying to breed them to the same stud or different studs? If it’s the same stud, maybe it’s something they know about him that they won’t allow him to cover. I know we’ve had studs that wouldn’t hardly pay a female any attention when she came in until the day that she was ready to accept a male. From that day on they were all about her until she quit accepting m, but I hey sure wouldn’t bother with her until she was exactly ready. Maybe these females are going through something similar. The environment/ climate can definitely play a role. It affects other species why wouldn’t it affect a dog? YEARS ago I had a fella bring a pit gyp to me to breed to my old Simba dog. He said she was a bad hussy when it came to time to be bred, that she would eat a male dog up that tried to cover her. We put her on a chain in the back yard and turned him into her. Now he’s the kind that would not put his mouth on a female unless she actually hurt him and even then it was only enough to check her. They start smelling each other and he gets excited and goes to mount her and she lit into him. He persisted and it just kept on that way for a few minutes and finally she got ahold and drew blood. He reared up and just like a human would do, slapped her and knocked her down then stood over her until she submitted. When he let her up she stood and let him have his way. That guy nor myself had ever seen a game of dominance like that. He was a mature stud at that time. I don’t know if your stud(s) are young or not? I was told that those ovulation tests for women would work on dogs. You use to be able to get them from Walmart. I don’t know if you still can or not.


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 I used 2 different males, both mature, one of them had been bred extensively, the other had not been bred. Had raised a litter out of the one that had been bred and one of the females. The one that had been bred is an aggressive breeder, the one that had not been bred paid them little attention, leading me to believe they weren't ready, so I kept trying them every 48 hrs.

Clue, I just went thru the same thing. The best dog on my place is a female I call Cypress. A real cold nosed bear and hog dog. she just dosent need help in any department. When she was a 2 year old a friend of mine was hunting her in New Mexico and she came in heat. He brought her to me and we tried to breed her. She fought us tooth and nail and I just assumed we waited too long and she was out of heat. I skipped her next cycle because I didnt need any pups at the time. She waited a year and a 1/2 and came in heat and I waited about 10 days from when  she first started bleeding and again just fought us and we didnt get it done. Next time I am going to take her to the Vet and do a progesterone test and have her AI ed .

Sometimes they just don't cycle right I guess, the progesterone test would confirm that.  But I have been told the progesterone tests for AI breeding are suggested to be in multiples so they can determine the optimal time as the hormone levels can vary from female to female. Seems like they told me 13-17 was typical, but I am not positive it has been so long ago.

It seems like everybody i have talked to last several years has had trouble getting gyps bred i know in last few years I have bred few outside females and got zero puppies out of my cur dogs bred one gyp that one side of her is my dogs the other side not she took he has 2 young dogs that several people has told me doing really well i finally raised a litter out of my black gyp this year I borrowed a black male i use to have to bred a gyp for my buddy and she only had 1 puppy

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I had the same problem breeding a few females and I swapped to some cheap dog food and they started having normal heat cycles…I bred one of the females and she had a healthy litter…I was told to use a certain dog food because originally he had the same problem with his females…I think plain purina dog
chow will work as well…

I don’t remember the dog food I used but the title had the word Ranch in it…I don’t hog hunt anymore and am down to one old dog…letting him live out his old age in comfort in my backyard…

I don’t have any breeding experience with my crop of dogs, I have people with litters around offering me pups. I wouldn’t mind getting some pups out of my females (who are both in heat) I just don’t want to make a litter for no reason. If I had friends tell me they wanted pups from what I have, I’d do it, guess that means my pot lickers aren’t impressing my friends.

Now when i had the jagdterriers, my gyp came in heat like clockwork, but she would never let a male mount her. I did try to breed her to a real good male. After that failed fiasco, I had her fixed and called it.

Reuben, what was the difference in the dog food that made a difference in the heat cycle?


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 I mentioned that the "keep" hasn't changed in years, that includes the dog food and the formula listed on it, so I haven't blamed the dog food. In fact, due to my lack of paying enough attention I had two accidental litters in the last year or so. One litter is about a year old and the other is 5 months.

We just had that happen to our BMC's both mature and had good litters a few yrs back. And you know what bad luck we had with the dogos last yr

There is your problem
Murphys law.......You want them bred and they wont have pups......when you don't want them, they will have 15 fat healthy puppies in the mud under the barn! LOL

I have terrible luck in breedings dogs so I am no help.

I would guess,  you could really only know the answer with the progesterone testing. It's my understanding they have to be tested every day in cycle to get what you need. Depending on availability to a vet it can make it inconvenient.

T-Dog…I never did find out but I was using Sportsmix…I felt like it was the dog food because years before I had the same problem…

below I copied off of copilot...

some commercial dog foods contain ingredients that mimic estrogen or interfere with hormone signaling.
Phytoestrogens (Plant Estrogens)
These are natural estrogen‑like compounds found in:

Soybean meal

Corn gluten

Flaxseed

Pea protein

Many mid‑tier dog foods use these as cheap protein sources.

Phytoestrogens can bind to estrogen receptors and confuse the reproductive system, causing:

Delayed heat

Silent heat

Weak or incomplete cycles

Missed breeding windows

???? 2. Excessive Grain-Based Diets
High‑grain foods (corn, wheat, sorghum) can:

Spike insulin

Increase systemic inflammation

Disrupt the hypothalamus–pituitary–ovary hormone axis

This can lead to irregular estrous cycles or anestrus (no heat)

I will say this as well, back in the 1970-90's i didn't feed the expensive dog foods because the expensive dog foods back then were super expensive like almost a dollar a pound...it was a rich mans dog food...and i never had any issues breeding dogs back then with the cheaper feed...I remember some were thinking it was an iodine issue once these problems started popping up...

Maybe I’m just slow Reuben, most of the “cheap” feeds are the ones that typically use the soy, grain, and chicken-by -products because of their availability and being cheaper to use.  I assume you are saying that because of that the dogs are having a more regular/stronger cycles when they come in?

I have preached against soy for years, in animals and people. They have found out that babies raised on soy formula have issues. Little girls that develop/mature early are usually soy formula babies and they usually have very erratic and severe minstrel cycles. Little boys that are raised on soy formulas are prone to having “man boobs” and maturing slower/later with less masculine characteristics. The estrogen hormone works the same in all species and we all know there has to be a balance. Peas are a cousin to soy as are peanuts. I don’t think peanuts are as high in this phytoestrogen. It’s in a lot of fruits and nuts but not as high. I don’t think it’s detrimental here and there but using it consistently is the issue. I’m bay no
means an expert. This is one of those things I have looked into because of my intestinal disease and my dogs.


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Driving and didn’t get to read over everything yet, but didn’t see it mentioned at a glance. Are you letting these dogs live together through duration of heat?
Sometimes a lady demands a long courtship before they’ll bed down with a man.


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  One other female that I have just happens to be the mother of that Cypress female. she has had two normal litters and now she will act like she is coming in heat, drip a little blood for a couple of days and thats it. Will not flag or show any interest in a male. All my other females seem to have normal cycles. A hereditary  deal maybe except all my dogs are related top and bottom. Another thing I have noticed, none of my females ever come in heat around 9-10 months. The seem to come in around 15-16 months of age.

 I had a Plott female that was the same way Mike, really wanted pups out of her and never got them.

  No Slim, I never do that, reason being I want to know for sure whether they have tied or not. I will leave them together to get acquainted a couple of hours checking on them every 20 minutes or so if they haven't bred yet. But usually after the first breeding they will be tied in just minutes, then I come back and separate them.

T-DOG...you are right...todays dog foods do have all the extra vegan nuts and grains that supposedly are healthy but not so...the cheap dogs food from yesteryears did have lots of grain, peas and soy were not in the ingredients...below i copied off copilot...

5. Foods That DON’T Cause This Problem
Breeders who want reliable heat cycles avoid soy and heavy grains.

They typically use:

Victor Hi‑Pro Plus

Purina Pro Plan Sport

Diamond Naturals Beef & Rice

Native Level 3 or 4

Raw or fresh diets (if done safely)

These avoid the estrogen‑mimicking ingredients.

6. The Mechanism (Step‑by‑Step Logic Chain)
Soy + flax + corn → high phytoestrogen load

Grain batches sometimes → zearalenone contamination

These compounds → mimic estrogen

The dog’s body thinks it’s already in a hormone cycle

Real estrous cycle gets suppressed

Female barely comes into heat or has silent heat

Thanks Reuben, glad to see you’re still around and hear from you.


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Same here...thanks