EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

Just wondering if anybody knows what grade of kevlar ugly dog ranch is using. I like my vest, but it did get cut through pretty early. I think the vest is 4 layers which should have been plenty. This shouldn't have happened. However, it did same my dogs life. I think the vest is made well..they don't fall apart.

(4 layer vest. Outer layer: 1050 Denier Nylon Ballistic. Inner layers: Dupont Kevlar, Ripstop, 1050 Denier Nylon Ballistic material. Comes standard with high neck that overlaps the cut collar and protective leg flaps/sleeves. Two neck straps, three body straps, nickel plated hardware, and refletive strips on each side. Light weight and flexible with full body coverage.)

I know there are many different types of kevlar, which is why im asking this question.

I know Jake, with southern cross, runs a lot of 600 that's treated I believe. I've heard water can break it down. Jake's vests have taken a lot of abuse and haven't been cut through.

I know Micheal Spiehler has his new vest out, and Says they are the same or better than Jake's.  Just got off the phone with him and he's running 850+ treated kevlar. I believe that you don't have to have 4 layers of kevlar if you have the right kevlar and other materials.

So anyway, here's a few pics.

(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f236/JaredJHarms/kevlarvest001.jpg)

(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f236/JaredJHarms/kevlarvest002.jpg)

(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f236/JaredJHarms/kevlarvest003.jpg)

(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f236/JaredJHarms/kevlarvest004.jpg)

Man I don't know the answer to what they use but why not just call them and ask? In my opinion and no offensce meant just my thoughts but on catch vest as long as all I get through mine is a poke then I am cool w/ that,only a poke but not a long cut. I think some peopple expect a vest to be inpenatrable under all circumstances but every hog is different as well as every dog is different in its size,weight and height as well as how they catch so I guess my point is if there ever is a vest that is 100% unpenatrable then you will sacrifice mobility and heat too much (and even if it was guaranteed unpenatrable I think used enough times the circumstance can arise where even the best may get a poke). I the poke in the pic is from the big hog you recently posted and if it was as rough as you said then your vest really did its job as that looked and sounded like a good,rough hog.The vest you have at this point for me is about what I like on mine,just about right...may get a poke very seldom but wont get the dog ripped.

Stoked. Have u talk to L3 outdoor. U should call josh talk to him he uses viper cloth.

Man I think I have one just like it, went out Sun. and had one go through it and rip a dog pretty good. I've had the vest a few months a its been used maybe 10 times, I have lots of other vest, I think this one is going to be put aside, its way to thin.

(http://i330.photobucket.com/albums/l404/colton_baker/330.jpg)

(http://i330.photobucket.com/albums/l404/colton_baker/327.jpg)

Is this supposed to be in penatrable?

Nothin is. Tusk proof. For say.  But his catch dog vest are two or three layers of viper cloth. Reinforced with thick biothane. Just contact him mine should be done this week

Exactly....was it not determined in a recent vest post that the viper cloth was one grade below kevlar?

Caney Creek your vest was poked through the lighter material. The black portions of the vest are wet felt. That vest provides protection, but obviously not to the level you want. If you don't want that vest, send it to me...I'll use it ;)

I don't know about all that but I got an ugly dog devastator and some bay vest from L3. And I like the viper cloth

X2

Cool......

Scott,if you get it can I borrow it?  ;D

Casey, if you get it I will tade ya for that big one I got  ;)

Anytime....anytime ;)

deal   that one dont look lik it will fit my dane anyway

i was talking to mike about the viper cloth and people are saying good things about it. he said they havent had enough experience with it yet to really speak too highly about it. he did say that his new vests are what he is now running on his dogs and that he will bet money against his 3 or 4 layer vests against these 6 or 7 layer vests with 3 or more layers of kevlar. he said jake's vests have never been cut through, and they have caught a ton of trophy boars. he took 6 or so years of hunting those vests and made his own which are basically a hybrid of jakes that are modified with better features that they didnt like about the other vests.

from what i understand, the kevlar is still better. viper cloth feels a lot thicker which lead people to believe its better. kevlar is more cut proof and lighter on your dogs. a lot of people buy by feel which is not always better.

Viper cloth is inpenetrable by a snake if used in layers. I don't hunt snakes!! I am using the 3/4 Kevlar vest pictured in OP and have yet to have any complaints about its performance. I knew when I purchased it that I was sacrificing protection for the vest to be more lighter and more mobile on my dog, Now that I think about it I wish I would have had an extra layer of Kevlar put in on the underside of the ripstop but that is just me. Every vest and Breastplate has its pros and cons but as long as it is keeping the dogs vitals intact I believe it is serving its purpose.

Yes, viper cloth is a second rate material to kevlar for cut resistence.

Take an ice pick to four layer kevlar vest and then do the same to a two or three layer Viper cloth. The ice pick goes right through the Kevlar BECAUSE all kevlar is an open weave material. Kevlar has nothing to hold the layers together so even if its quilted the quilts would have to be 1/2 or smaller to stop the layers from seperating enough for a sharp tooth to not find a hole and snag. Viper cloth is extremely tight woven and impregnanted with resin to hold the weave together. Viper cloth also works on shear thickness of material than anything. Two layers of Viper cloth is over 1/8 inch thick, and three layers is more than 3/16 inch thick. Add a 1/8 layer of Biothane on top and you have some really tuff stuff that will not hold water because the material is filled with resin and glued between layers. I will say that Viper cloth is not a good material for making leg hole style vests because of this thickness. Nothing is cut proof and one layer of Viper cloth or Kevlar is a waist of time in any style vest. Add the fact that your vest is not glued or quilted and it's no surprise that it got a hole in it. Add glue or something to hold the weave of Kevlar together and you make it ten times stronger, but 1 inch quilting will do little at all to add POKE resistance to Kevlar.

 Thanks for posting the pics. I think alot of people get caught up in the name game. No vest is bullet proof, well kevlar is bullet proof. So lets say no vest is cut proof, thats more like it. Those vests are made ten times better now then they were a few years ago. Cuts are going to happen. I think very few people can argue the materials in vests. I try but it is all stuff I read on the www. Hell even past vest makers have weak arguements. I like felt. Alot of people like kevlar. And vest makers also have to watch the bottom line................

Stoked: 
Your Vest is the Ugly Dog Kevlar Vest.  It is our economy kevlar vest.  It only has one layer of kevlar.  If you want more protection, I suggest getting the Guardian Kevlar vest.  You have the option of 2, 3, or 4 layers of kevlar sandwiched betweeb 2 layers of Cordura.  We get postive feedback on this vest all the time.  Also the Devastator vest has 3 layers of kevlar in the neck and chest areas between 2 layers of cordura and the body has 2 layers kevlar between 2 of cordura. 
No vest is unpuncturable.  If it saved your dogs life then it did its job!  (WBUSA)

I agree that the UDR Devastator cut vests do their job. I have not had a cut through up to date. I am sure it will happen one day but my vests have held together and saved my dogs butts many times from big teeth. Heres a picture of a few of my RCDs.

(http://ushogoutfitters.com/dogos-UGD-vests.jpg)

Caney Creek Hog Doggers:

The vest you have pictured is the Ugly Dog Cut vest.  It does not have any kevlar in it.  Its base has 3 layers of cordura and the front and side panels have wet felt inside.  (WBUSA)

a ton of hogs must hunt 24/7 everybody has one opinion and asssholes think i like what ever it takes

If the matterial was put in a vest then it had to be cut. There fore no vest is cut proof.  If you were to make a matterial that was cut proof how would you make a vest out of it? ;D

Ditto!

Stoked, your vest did its job, your dog is alive to hunt another day. If you want a vest that has MORE cut resistance, then order a different vest. Uglydog has many styles that have more Kevlar and are VERY cut resistant as others have said.

Its just not the fabrics that go into a vest that make it stop a tusk. How it is designed and how the layers are put together and how much quilting is done. There is a balancing act between being cut proof, and mobility, and being cool enough to run when its hot, and amount of coverage.

You must take the time to understand the holding style of your dog, the conditions you hunt in, the temperatures you hunt in, the coverage you desire, and the mobility you want your dog to have while wearing a vest. I have 5 different styles of vest that I run on my catch dogs. I pick the best vest or plate for conditions on each hunt.

I believe that Uglydog makes the best full vests, and L3 makes the best breast plates.....make the choice that will work best for your dog in the conditions you hunt in.

 

I bought a guardian kevlar and met up with a 330lbs bad a$$ that left 7 holes in my brand new vest right off the bat but it save the dogs life and thats what it was intended for , ugly dog will repair the holes or neck piece on your vest, I think there a top notch outfit , I also think if all you got was one hole you fared out pretty good

I have a guy that sews my vests for me. They are made of two layers of 1000 Denier Cordura (green inside, Mossy Oak Camo on the outside) with one layer of Viper cloth between the two layers of Cordura. There is also a piece of wet felt in the chest plate area of the vest.

I agree that probably no vest is 100% cut/poke proof but we have had good luck with these. They are flexable enough that the dogs mobility isn't hindered, yet stout enough to protect the dog as well as most vests can. Plus we can make them 2" longer (to the end of the rib cage) with a cut out for male dogs.

You can see pics at www.crackercreations.net. I would post a pic here, but am having trouble posting pics due to my slow a** dial up connection here at home...........

i've looked at all the vests on uglydog... ive hunted around them and agree that the guardian and devastator are great vests. i just can't make myself spend $180. I like my economy kevlar vest, i just can't believe it got cut through that soon/ easy. i just don't understand how mike and them have been running 1 layer of kevlar and a couple other materials excluding viper cloth and they have been on 200+ trophy boars without a single cut through. This was why i was asking which grade of kevlar you guys are using. Ill probably end up buying a devastator or elimator if that is what it takes to keep my dogs safe. I just thought you can run less layers with good grade treated kevlar. i don't want a bunch of weight on my catch dog, we hunt around a lot of water. a vest like that could be dangerous for my bulldog if he got in the water and i couldn't get to the bay. i haven't tried the viper cloth because it's thick and stiff. i would only be able to run 1 layer of that. the dogs don't wanna roll if they can't move. they start coming back early and don't wanna leave. it's hard enough far em as thick as it is. the last hunt i got out the boat and called a few dogs out because they had been on a long run and i nearly wanted to cry when i saw the crap they were coming through. those poor dogs are so tough.

do you know where to get the 1000 denier cordura mossy oak camo material.

we can't get it anymore... do you have a name and number?

I understand that wet felt is supposed to help in the water, I have two of these vests and they do worst out of the others, the guardian seems to do the trick.  Idk what I'm talking about just rambling off stuff I hear, I know ya'll can't be perfect on all the products but all the products have saved some lives and they make it through another hunt, so I'm satisfied.I'll be seeing ya'll next week, me and my dad need more vest and supplies!!

wet felt is not good in water. It will wick up mosture.

Stoked, we bought a bunch of the Mossy Oak material when we had the chance, not sure if they still make it or not. Now I see mostly what they call the "digital" camo, which I don't care for. I may have to go to solid color Cordura when I am out of the Mossy Oak.

Well that explains it all, I almost lost several dogs due to the vest getting way to heavy in the water!!!

Stoked, I have tried to stay out of this discussion because I am very Strong opinioniated about what works best and why.

You asked how Mike and the others have been on so many trophy hogs with no cuts through the vest.
Here is my Honest opinion and no offense meant to anyone. 
1. All materials will meat that particular hog that really tests it, it does not have to be a big hog, not the longest tusks, it can 1" cutters on a 150 lb boar. That particular hog, That particular day, and the way your dog stands his ground, makes all the difference. The chance that that vest will get cut again are very slim, maybe never.
2. How far are you sending your dog? Is the dog Knee deep in mud? So the dog is forceed to stand and not move? This is about absorbtion of impact, Force has to be absorbed somewhere /somehow and if there is "NO GIVE" then the dog and the Vest have to absorb the impact of a sharp object.
3. Anybody turning there dog loose and haveing the dog stay caught for several minutes before you take the hogs momentum away, by Taking his legs out from under him, Well you are at MUCH greater RISK for these vests and your dogs absorbing the IMPACT and TAKING CUTS, PERIOD. (Any Vest)
4. Some folks let their catch dogs go and take 10 minutes to get there, others wait until they can be right behind the dog and are their to help the dog get relief immediatley. I have watched videos on U-Tube where dogs are caught solid and the people are scared and waiting/watching as their dogs and the hog both get tired (this disgusts me personally).
5.Take your ice pick and lay your material flat on a hard surface, then drive the ice pick at it, yeah you will probly go through now have some one hold it uu while you do the same thing the material and movement both absorb the force and this is closer to what happens when your dog is being hit, if your dog is up against a tree or rock or buried in deep mud, this is closer to the same as what will happen when the material is laying on a hard surface when you stab it.  NOW DOES THIS MAKE SENSE? This is how certain material are designed to work and why one material will work better in one situation better than others.
6. Denier Cordura is the material that is on the outside of your black Kevlar vest, it has different properties, than Kevlar and why it is outside covering the Kevlar, they are made to work different, Curdura works like a Carhart Jacket for you, Good about keeping briars and barbwire off you, Ripstop keeps the materials from slicing  sideways, and the Kevlar is to absorb the impact. All things together is what makes the Vest a QUALITY PRODUCT with maximum protection. However NOTHING is full Proof 100%, Only a FOOL would believe that or try to sell that.
I have used Kevlar for many years on many  different dogs, lasting throughs several Hundred hogs, Never have I had a cut through to my dog, maybe three pencil tip sized pokes that never touched the dog only. You go into UGLYDOG/WBUSA shop and look at the old ragged out vest hanging on the wall, look inside and out, that is where the proof is, It lasted one dog through his retiterment and Thomas Cotton dog for two years of serious hunting, and the only reason we handed that vest over to WBUSA is for them to use as testimonial that it works and lasts. You can come see our picture book and hog counts and see what kind of hogs that vest had been on. Then come see the vest I have the exact same thing Stoked does for My females and the other Kevlars we have here and what they have been through. I am not talking about a product that has been in the hunting field for less than two years, this has been worked over and put to the TEST.  This website supports certain products for a reason, they work,
Disclaimer: may not be intended for internet hog hunters!

here is my new vest from wild boar usa i love still gets cut but not nere as bad

(http://i34.tinypic.com/245kpeh.jpg)

(http://i34.tinypic.com/i1fhpi.jpg)

(http://i35.tinypic.com/30w2usm.jpg)

I'm not sure what vest we have but it has saved our cd more that once. It may not have many layers of kevlar but it is light and allows the dog to twist and turn as needed.

(http://i490.photobucket.com/albums/rr266/djhogdogging/ammosvest001.jpg)

The hog that did this sent my dogs running back to us all big eyed like "you can get that hog yourself!!!"LOL
(http://i490.photobucket.com/albums/rr266/djhogdogging/ammosvest003.jpg)

When you get a poke like that $5 poxy from wall mart seals them up stronger than they were before it works great and keeps the vest from weakening. The kind I have you have to mix two tubes together.  ;)

It cracks me up when people complain about getting a cut through their vest... i'll leave it at that. ;)

I'm not complaining... I love our kevlar vest. When i see that it has been cut through I can just imagine what my dog would look like if he hadn't been wearing it. Plus, I don't think that there is anything that a hog cant' cut through and still be comfortable enough for your dog.  ;) When we wear this one out we are going to buy another one!

Mike, don't you know that they get cut through cause the catch dogs don't catch properly (http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r219/BONEDIGGERKENNELS/2funny.gif)

How does a cd catch properly, its hard to say, i think its a false statement. If your dogs aren't getting cut at least a little, it doesn't mean they catch properly it means they haven't met the right hog. jmo

That's an inside joke between Bryant and I. ;)

My dogs usually conspire and get a game plan together on the way to the hunt.

I have noticed that most of the times one of my jagds will kick sand in the hogs eyes just before Jack goes in for the catch.

However... sunday the dogs got in a pretty good fight prior to the hunt ....which might explain why Jack took a pretty good shot through the vest that night.

They set Jack up?!! That is some serious stuff that you need to get under control right away, it could lead to a split between the strike dog & the catch crew!!

Yeah...we are having a serious talk today.  ;D

may be time for an intervention.  see if they'll tell you where they hid jack's lip.

Yeah, that's all Jake and mike can get right now. I don't like it near as much as the other stuff. :(

was hoping you knew where to get the old mossy oak...loved the look of that...

All BS aside, I love my $120 dollar vest, which is now $130. The people who sew the material are very good. The vest holds up which is why I bought it. The only vest I would buy other than uglydog are Southern cross, L3, and Mike's new vests.

Now, I know you can't expect a vest to be 100% hog resistence, but the vest is very new and it wasn't a small poke, it was a complete cut through. After looking at the vest more, the overlapping collar had been completely cut through as well. The leg flap was cut through which wasn't a surprise because they are thin. It was a big hog and the body of the vest took some hits but no cut throughs. I got to the hog and dogs in about 2 minutes after they bayed for the second time. I'm happy with the vest! I didn't post this topic to try and stir the pot. I didn't post this topic to try and upset people or to make uglydog look bad. I think uglydogranch has the best catch vests on the market, which is why I'm running one. I'm trying to avoid running a lot of layers.

The reason why I posted this topic was because I wanted to know what kind of kevlar was used in that vest and if it was treated. I still haven't got an answer to that question. Like I said, Mike and the crew have ran Jake's vests for about 6 years without a single cut through. I don't know how that can happen, but I talk to mike pretty frequently and he'll insist that those vests are tough. Surely somebody would have leaked out the bad news if the vests was cut through. Watch their new video, they put it on the screen again. " NOT ONE SINGLE CUT THROUGH "

My vest is 4 layers with one being kevlar and the chest plate is 5 layers with one being kevlar. The plate is what got cut through. I'm just trying to figure out what the material was because i want to try and correct the problem without running 15 layers of material.

Krystal, thanks for the info.