EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

Ok so I kinda miss the dog doctor forum, and I know its still all here, I just can't seem to find the search button.

I feel like even though I have a small firstaide kit in my backpack when hunting, I wouldn't really be that confident having to work on a dog.

So I was thinking maybe it would help some people out to have everyone post about different bad things that can or have happened to you or friend's dogs, and ways that what you did  helped, or what you should have done.

I have a couple questions to start it off, like what do I do If my dogs guts are coming out of a pinky sized hole in front of his rear leg, what if its a big hole?

What if you can hear air moving in  and out of a hole in the ribs?

And a question most people don't like to talk about when should you just put the dog down instead of letting it suffer more?
I figure most people don't look for answers untill it affects them.

And feel free to contradict what others choose to do, just tell us why.

Here's what have done and seen in those situations...

1. Clean any of the exposed gut with saline solution and make sure there is no damage or cuts to it. Sew the liner muscle with diissovable sutures, then staple or sew the skin. It helps if you have lidocaine to deaden the area, you may need to cut the skin more in order to work. Then start the dog on antibiotics.
 
2. Just like above, you'll need to sew the liner to the chest cavity. On the last stich, before you close the opening, have someone compress the dog's chest to get any air out of the chest cavity. While compressed, seal the hole... then staple or sew the skin.

3. As far as putting a dog down... that's completely up to the dog's owner.


If you're not confident or sure of your work in the field, get the dog to vet to be checked out, just to be safe.

Sometimes there is no time to get to a vet.  So you have to tell yourself either I help this dog or he's going to die.  This should persuade you or build your confidence.  Main thing is to also be prepared for the worse. Know CPR for dogs it helps!

When it comes to trauma...CPR will only work if the bleeding is controlled (stopped). If you don't stop the bleeding...it don't matter.


For wounds that have punctured the chest cavity, I carry a piece of clear plastic (freezer bag/sandwich bag, etc.) in my pack. Put the clear plastic over the wound and then vet wrap a little wider than the plastic. That'll help prevent/slow the collapse of the lung until you can fix it yourself as Mike described, or get the dog to the vet.

Mike is right I'm a firm believer in antibiotics.  I had my main strike dog nearly get castrated by a nasty boar, the cut started on his right back leg right to his man hood, and down his left leg.  This cut was deep into muscle.  Cleaned it the best I possible could, stapled him up, & pumped him with antibiotics for 3weeks.  He healed up good.  My catch dog was stabbed in his left flank by the same boar with and a small piece of intestant was hanging out..... Did what Mike suggested and he was fine.  You have to make sure you sew the muscle lining good cause my dog had a small hernia from it.  

We had one dog get a good portion of his ear bit off by a big boar.  Ear cuts are bad to thin to staple or sew and the ear has tons of blood vessels.  The poor dogs ear was litterally shooting blood out.  We tried everthing clotting powder, wrapping, bandage, but nothing was working. So we waited for the pain medication to kick in and use a truck lighter to stop the bleeding.  It worked!

Like I said be prepared for the worse.  We had a hog fall on top of a dog going from one field to the next.  Dog was choked to death as she was tied to the dog box.  I mean this dog was not breathing nothing.  I started CPR and by the grace of the man up stair brought her back.  You can also have a dog drown on you and CPR can be preformed.

Good stuff guys..........

Also when you are dealing with an open chest wound that is sucking air..... it is important to remember that the problem is air entering through the wound and into the space around the lung and preventing the lung from inflating correctly when the dog inhales.  The alveoli (lung sacks) wont contribute to oxygen exchange if they are not inflated.  So what air does enter has a smaller surface area to work with.  Inhalation is based on creating a negative  pressure when you inhale your diaphragm and other chest muscles conract which creates increased volume of the chest cavity.  Then air rushes in to equalize the pressure.  That is inhalation.  A hole in the chest wall disturbs that process to varying degrees which depends on how big the hole or wound is compared to the size of the wind pipe.  If the hole is smaller than the wind pipe, more pressure will be equalized through that route and enter the lugs.  If the chest wound is larger than the circumfrence of the wind pipe then little air will enter the lungs and a greater proportion will enter the space around the lungs.  Esentially the dog is suffocating.  So the first thing to do is occlude the wound site.  

If you take a piece of plastic and tape it on three sides it will allow air to escape but not move back in from the outside... which is the goal.  Its called an occlusive dressing.  It helps to shave the area around the wound site so the tape will stick.  They also make a commercial wound dressing for open chest wounds called an ascherman chest seal.  You can buy it on the net.

The next thing to do is repair the chest wall with sutures.  Now I am a do it your self guy as much as anybody but i reccomend a vet for this kind of work if at all possible.  If you dress the wound like described above and the occlusive dressing is doing its job correctly, the dog will be stabilzed to give enough time to get to a vet.

This is just some stuff I've learned since being a paramedic.  I will post some about closed chest wounds later.  Sometimes when dogs take a blow to the chest there may not be any external damage but could be internal damage to the lung (like a pneumo or hemo thoraxy) and I think that accounts for a portion of the unexplained dog lossess that sometimes happen.  But more on that later.  LOL....Dont miss spell accounts or it will say this... "awhat you never call a womans"

Waylon  

Mike & Scott are both right on.  First priority is to stop any bleeding.  If you aren't confident working on your dog, get it to a vet.  The bad part about that is you probably won't be confident working on a dog until you have actually worked on a few.  Its great to have a good relationship with your vet.  When I first started hunting, I would watch the vet do his work and ask a lot of questions and assist in any way I could.  After a few years of toothy boars, I feel confident in my work to save a dog's life.  The only thing I would absolutely never do myself is work on a dog who actually has a punctured gut where food material is leaking.  There is too high of a risk for infection.  On the flip side of that, I have never seen a vet have to sew a gut up.

(Thanks Dr. Danny Welch in LaGrange & Dr. Clint Kainer in Flatonia)

I think it's important to have the proper mindset BEFORE you make the decision to begin hogdoggin. You have to understand that it's not IF but WHEN you will need to render life saving care to your dog in the field. I would suggest to folks that arent inclined, to hunt with an experienced 'buddy'  who can be observed performing the techniques stated above  in this post.. I believe the dogs deserve that you have the knowledge and intestinal fortitude to do wat's necesary to save them in the field. If that's not the case, you need to hunt some other critter or hogs by some other method. 

Heat exhaustion, loss of blood, and then shock seems to be a big cause of death out in the field. So how do you fellow hog hunters treat this? Someone already discussed the bleeding part and I agree. It needs to be stopped any way possible to keep the dog from dying from loss of blood/shock.

Mike and Scott and waylon gave some good advice. When a dog is sucking air it's hard to know what to do unless someone has showed you first hand. Unless you've saw a stomach liner get sewed up or a chest cavity compressed to push out the air it's just hard to know what to do when you are in the woods or back at your house. I'm lucky enough to have a good ol country vet that showed me a lot first hand and taught me how to do a lot of those things and if at all possible I recommend asking your vet to show you a few basic things, if they are willing. Some are not going to do it and some couldn't even do it themselves.
I say do as much as you feel confident about by yourself but if you are questioning yourself take your dog to the vet..

Sorry but I don't agree, yes you should be prepared to do everything you can to help your dog, and yes we should learn as much as we can, but i Don't think someone who wants to dog hunt should wait till they have seen a dog gutted and  a chest cavity punctured etc etc..... untill they they can hunt without a buddy who has seen and done it all.

Now you use the words "aren't inclined" and "intestinal fortitude" Im not "inclined" or talented at working on dogs, but I wouldn't be scared to do it if I had an Idea how.


Unfortunatley we cant always be expert at everything, sometimes you have to learn as you go, thats why we tap into the knowledge of others on a board like this

Jdjp, you are then, inclined to attempt to perform life saving procedures in the field. I guess i'm referring to folks who's only recourse would be to try to get a critically wounded dog to vet without trying to get it stabilized in the field.

I agree, the more you know the better off your dogs will be. Sometimes we just can't be prepared enough.


I also believe that when a pup or a dog has a life threatening illness/injury that keeping the dog company during the first day or so might be the difference whether the dog makes it or not. I will have the dog ride in the cab with me and at home I will put the dog next to my recliner and that is where I'll sleep. The dog needs to know you are right there with him and that you care...

I agree with this, I have been huntin with people with a weak stomach, cant even touch a dog with their guts hangin out or sew or staple up their own dog. For this I say, STAY AT THE HOUSE