EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

Just out of curiosity how many of the hunters on the board have hunted with full time running catch dogs, or finder/holder type dogs? I am not talking about a dog used with your bay dogs, I'm talking about a dog or pack of dogs that would find hogs and catch them selves without the help of bay dogs to do the finding. For example only used a pack of pure Dogo's to find and catch there pigs. I Myself have never owned a bay dog, but have been on plenty of hunts with them owned by other people. I started with one big Ridgeback imported from Africa hunted him "One Out" until I got a Pit/Ridgeback (16 years old and still alive). Tryed hunting more than one dog on the ground and my numbers of injuries went up and my number of pigs caught went down so I started hunting the dogs without each other and things went back to normal. Over the years I have had many more but have stayed true to the finder/holders.

I used to use my male and female ab's as a pair of running catch dogs and had good luck finding hogs with them.  The only problem with using bulldogs as running catch dogs is that they are incredibly short range and won't find as many hogs as a good cur. I also ran into a problem with my male exhausting all of his energy after the first hog or two and not having the stamina to catch as solid.  My female on the other hand is a freak and can run all day and catch multiple hogs and never even show a sign of tiring. I have gone to using a mix of rcd's and cur's.  My female is always used as a rcd and it works great in tandem with a bulldog on a lead and two or three curs. Jmo, running catch dogs alone are good if they have the stamina to be solid the whole hunt but I think you will find more hogs with a couple of good, and I stress GOOD, curs in the mix.   It also doesn't hurt to have a few open mouths on a catch so you can hear when the hog is caught.

I run all Brindle Leopard  curs and cur crosses with one Reg Plott and all of mine find, hold and catch hogs with out bulldogs of course they work as a pack .  We have legged and caught numbers of hogs from 225 to 290 with out any bulldogs , dogo's, ridgebacks are any of the watch you call full time catch dogs are hold dogs. I guess you could call them running catch dogs hahahahahaha  Might not be what you are talking about but these find and hold hogs and if you dont get there fast nuff they aint gonna have any ears thats for sure.

TexasHogDogs
Jim

yea i have that pit curr mix bo that will find hogs and catch them even up to like 250 275. i have another pit curr that i use as a running catch dog but she does not have that stamina and endurance as that male dog does... when theres a bay she in on it... but that pit curr mix male dog is my head dog and he will hunt some what far out, what i mean by that is usually from 200- 500 yrds. and he will find a hog using his nose. but i think that every dog is a little different. of course most runnign catch dogs are going to catch, BUT the question is if they have the hunt in them or not....some do and some dont...alot will just runn along side of you and catch when theres a bay, and some will hunt just as much and be gone just as long as they strike dogs will but when they find they CATCH! This is a pretty good way for us to go because of the smaller places that we hunt. i dont want to have a dog yip behind a 80lb sal for a mile till it finally wears down. I like som e grit to stop a hog but the trick to for the dog to know what he can and catch catch by himself without getting cut down! this is just my opinion on it! And it all differs with the types of places and terrian you hunt also!

This seems to be a never ending topic on all boards. RCD, "one out", lead in; everyone has a way that works for them in the country they hunt. Hunting the country I do without a bay dog would be pointless; also useing an RCD would be asking for trouble. "One out" in my country would also be asking for trouble.

There is a time and a place for every style of hunting. I posted this before to another one of these kinds of topics.....I have hunted "one out", RCDs, and now use only lead in catch dogs. I will never go back to either hunting the country I do. I have fewer dogs injured and catch far more hogs hunting the way I do now than I ever did before.

L3 after some thought I would like to invite you to the Hill Country to hunt. This is not a "my dog is better" thing or anything like that. I would just like to see a good "one dog out" dog work in the Hill Country. Ill leave my start/hold/bay/find/catch dogs at home, we will do it your way.

Just a plain invite to come hunting, your way in some different country. We would be hunting the Utopia/Vanderpool/Leakey area.

The topic is not about witch style is best, I was wanting to know whos hunting that way and what there thoughts are and how they hunt. TXmaveric, I grew up in the hill country and find it no more chalanging than any other place. You must keep in mind that I live in "Tunnel Brush South Texas". I will PM you on putting a hunt together. The biggest factor with RCD's is the dog getting flicked and not being able to catch up with the hog, but I'm sure this happens alot less than broken bays. If you use good dogs that catch smart and some good cut gear you shouldn't loose any more dogs than with any other style of hunting. With that said BULLDOGS do not make good running catch dogs as a hole. You get your super stars, but for the most part they dont use there head when holding and find them selves jacked up a tree or worse. Not picking on bulldogs just stateing my exsperence with them. I dont care for holding dogs that have more than 50% or so bull blood in them. To much bull blood and you run into some problems biggest being that they will catch the first hog they come to even if its 10 pounds. I fell a good holding dog should dance like a boxer with both eyes open watching the hog and there suroundings. JMO

i  run a straight catahoula pack and have had  several great ybmc also that eould shut a hog down and catch. flip and stick,,tap out the dogs and its roll out and do it again,  there are a few here thats hunting mine and chads dogs we trained or hunted with us
         Dexter

I use a "rcd" or a very ruff dog when I hunt. Helps cut down on the running hogs. Usually one RCD and one bay dog backed up by a lead in pit. First time I went hunting was with an old man than ran 4 pits loose. He caught some big hogs. I know he could probably have found more with curs but his way worked good. He used to brag that there wasn't a hog too big for his dogs. Seen them catch a 375 lb. boars with only minor injuries.

Dont have any RCD's but i have a question.

How do you find your dog if he is caught on a big hog 200 yards out and the hog isn't squeeling?

I don't have a RCD and doubt I'll ever have a need for one given the places I hunt but I have a question for L3.  You mention you have had more dogs get cut when running more than one at a time.  Why is that?  My understanding is that even the boys down under prefer to run more than one at a time if they can.  The Bloom brothers have even said they run "one out" more for the movie camera than for practical purposes.  Its more like "two or three out" when the camera is off.

Its seems like another dog would add to the anchoring of the hog and the catch would be less taxing with some help.

Clint, its not very hard to hear them they make quite a racket. Also most dogs with little bull blood will wine while holding making them easy to hear. If you read and talk to the Ozzies most will tell you the Blooms are a joke and its common place for them to buy trapped or pin raised hogs and make a video about it. I dont know them very well but my info comes from good sorces. I feel the hog puts the fight into over drive when you use more than one dog, and its not uncommon to see a dog just walking beside a big hog holding the ear and the hog is not even fighting. But I would have to say that they use more than one dog because of the flick factor. If your dog gets tosed off you have a extra dog to help. But these people dont purpus breed "One Out" dogs.

L3,

I was under the assumption that you drive around and turn out your "one-out" dogs on spotted hogs.  In fact, I recall a prior post you made where you stated that all your dogs are "trained" to follow a spotlight beam.  How is this done in "Tunnel Brush South Texas?"

damn that's a good question.....  i never knew Victoria was that thick.

I might be misunderstanding your question, but to me by definition Running Catch Dogs and finder/holder dogs are not anything alike

To me a RCD does not hunt anything by himself, he runs loose with the other dogs, and when they find/bay something he catches it.

Never hunted with a finder/holder dog that was hunted one out.  But I have hunted with a pack of rough dogs that went out and hunted, and found the hog then caught it. No need for bulldogs/catchdogs

Now I have a pack of loose baying dogs, ones that won't push a hog, and that will not catch until the bull dog is there. I can tell you that after hunting both rough dogs, and loose dogs. I prefer loose dogs. I don't keep records, but I don't think I lose any more hogs this way than when I hunted with a RCD or with a pack of "finder/holder".

we used to use nothing but bulldogs and had SOME success with it. I'm with RIP on this one though, I'd much rather have a pack of good curs and one good RCD with a bulldog on a lead. Or just hunt with some ROUGH curs and bulldogs on leads.

I've tried loose baying, straight RCDs, and a rough pack, I like the rough pack or using one RCD, as far as "one out" hunting, I really don't have the balls to do that style. I sure would like to see it done one day though. I think it's a cool idea but I'm afraid of vet bills just using one dog.

There is a ton of info on bay dogs on the web, but not much on my style of dog. So if I want to talk to people than have the same intrest's as me then there should be nothing wrong with it. Yes the topic comes up alot and that is because there is very little info on the topic. Second I dont live in Victoria, and I do alot of hunting south of I-37. Bryant to answer you question I get three months out of the year that I can see the hogs with spot lights. The rest of the time we never see the hogs until the dog is on. I hunt about 50/50 crops and heavy brush. I will say that with the exception of the thorns in the brush the crop hunting is much harder. Our corn grows seven to eight foot high and you can only see a foot or two in front of you. The dogs have to wind the hogs inside the corn and never see what they are chaseing until they bump into it. Circle C I would have to agree with you that a RCD is to be used with bay dogs, but most people call finder/holder dogs RCD's. Also a rough cur type is not a finder holder in my book. Yes they will do it, but if a dog bays just because he gets on a rough boar he is not a true finder/holder in my eyes. I dont mind if a holder bays because he has been holding for to long, but when I get there he should go back to holding so I can leg the hog. To me thats just a smart dog. Witch goes back to what I said about bulldogs. If he hangs to the death just because he is to hard to use his head he is not going to make a very good finder/holder. There are so many things that go into breeding a good finder/holder its hard to believe. I personaly fell that this type of dog is extremely hard to breed right. I learned most of what I know about this style of hunting through the school of hard nocks. There aren't many people you can get together with that hunt this style, unlike bay dogs. I fell it is pretty easy for a person to find friends and adivice on hunting bay dogs. I try to be respectful of everyones type of hunting even if I have tryed it enough to know its not for me. 1973 If people are hunting "One Out" because its more dangerus then they are doing it for all the wrong reasons. I am not pushing "One Out" hunting on anyone, and stand firm that it should only be tryed by someone who stands to gain from it to lesson cost of owning a biusness. This post was meant to be a tool that someone wanting to try finder/holder type hunting to use and gain from or even make up there mind that it's not for them.

I completely understand you L3. Many of people have criticized me for hunting with rough dogs that will find a hog, will hunt out up too 500 yrds or so, and will catch the hogs when they find them. Like i said earlier, i cant afford risking my dogs to run a mile or two across a neighboring place that i dont have permission to chasing a 80 lb shoat and have the risk of getting shot by the neighbor, all for a little 80 lb shoat, just because the dogs would stop em. And like i said earlier IT ALL DEPENDS ON THE TYPE OF TERRIAN AND THE PLACES THAT YOU HUNT in my opinion. To each his own, but i like a dog that will stop a hog, even bigger hogs, because im not all about the running and chasing a hog a mile or two thing with the smaller places that we hunt. and i do AGREE with L3 that trying to breed a dog like this takes alot. you have some of them that just have everything you want in them naturally, but trying to get a dog that will hunt out a ways, find a hog, and then hold em there till you get there is a hard thing to find in breeding a dog.

like Circle C said in a earlier post, the best thing to do is to keep an open mind about hog hunting and the different styles and or dogs used, until u have actually done it that way, and whatever types of style seems best for you, then use it. I dont think there is hardly any WRONG type of hog hunting or WRONG type of dogs used. JMO

i have two that are full time rcds they are pit bmc redbone crosses  ;D

Thanks for taking the time to write guys. Please post as much info as you can so that people that have quetions can learn and gain from a post like this.

I think there are many who talk (type) TONS more action and experience than they actually have.

I've said this before......If you can go in the woods with a pug and come out with a hog and you and your dog are alive then you are hog hunting and doing what we all enjoy.

As far as the Bloom's being fakes.....I can assure you they are not.....Is some of the footage staged or "edited"....sure it is...it is a production, not a documentary.....but I have hunted with their dogs and them and came out of the wild with some NICE boars.....They are for real and their dogs hunt....usually 2-3 at a time.

One-out is safer done 2-out but take my opinion for what it is worth.........

If you one-out and your dog is killed when his back-up is still tied in the back of the truck........You'll have to live with that......I prefer to give my dogs every advantage possible....back-up included......to each his own......

Ditto!

The post is not about "One Out" dogs, it's about finder/holders and what has and hasn't worked for people. The Blooms have some good dogs and I know Cody and the people that they hunted with in the US keep them strait. But there are alot of people that swear they have bought hogs from them and they ended up on the video. One of them was the guy that trained Doze. But as I said I dont know them very well. If they are hunting "One Out" because it looks good on film then I dont agree with it at all. If you get a dog killed because you didn't have a back up dog ready or you exspect a small dog to safely hold a pig "One Out" then I dont agree with that ether.

Well if you have a back-up dog ready, what's the logic behind not sending both?  How do you know dog #1 is in trouble before you get right up on the catch?  Do you lead dog #2 with you as you walk to the caught pig just in case?

Of the dogs I've personally lost, and the others that I have been witness to, all were either mortally wounded or dead upon our arrival to the catch.

A real hog dog is a real hog dog dont matter were he came from are how he is bred.  I think folks get a little carried away and  far fetched and get the cross hairs off the target which is getting the hog are hogs in the end , catch , shoot , stab are putting it in a head lock  who cares  .  I hunt with a lot of differnt people and it dont matter to me which way they want to do it .   If a dog  can find a hog thats great, if he can stop a hog that is great, if he can catch a hog that is great also it dont matter how many dogs  it takes are what breed are breeding  they are as long as the pork chops are on the pit at the end of the day and you yourself are happy .  This is just my opinion please nobody take it the wrong way hope not .

TexasHogDogs

Jim

Nicely put Jim.

Bryant the answer is yes you do.

  Yes you do what??????????


To add to what Bryant said the FEW small handfull of dogs that I have witnessed killed over the years were taken from this earth long before we arrived to the hog.........possably seconds from finding it.

 Just curious, how you can send backup if your one dog is in trouble and how you know he is in trouble when you cant see the hog until you arrive on the scene? 

Again, Just curious
Longshot

Ok so to stay on track.............Finder/holder seems you are talking about finder/catcher. All my dogs are finder/holder (if that is the term you want to use) dogs, they find a hog and push it so hard it has to bay. They do this by either catching it out right on smaller hogs or by working it like stock dogs would work a rough cow, then if they know they are in danger back off and bay. Holding a hog does not mean they catch every hog, holding means they hold a hog at bay, in other words making one bay, not just follow it until it wants to bay. If it tries to break then they are on its ass like stink to make it bay again. To the point if a big boar breaks into the open they will tag that stinky end and make him squeal like a pig.

If you mean finder/catcher then your back to RCDs or one dog out............this is why everyone keeps going back to the one dog out thing.

Now as for the "lesson the cost of owning a business" comment......are you saying that those of us that use bay dogs are in business?

Finder/holder or finder/catcher is a new term to me for sure but I am not to proud to learn something new as long as it makes sense. Just not sure the finder/holder or finder/catcher terms makes sense, it just seems like an contridiction of words.

One dog out ?
I guess this would mean one dog and one  dog only is a finder , a holder  and a catcher ,  are in my opinion this would be a  super dog with a short life  .

I can see why you say these dogs are very hard to breed if it was easy to get dogs like this why would anybody need a pack of dogs  ?

This is me but I could not ever see this kind of dog working in the country I live in to much brush to many thorn thicketts and just to thick period .  I know I would not want to walk up in a briar thickett so thick you cant see   with one dog only holding are catching  and me legging it  not on some of the hogs I have seen anyway.  I sure would not want to do this either in the corn stalks man you talk about dangerous now .  Out in the open country I could see it working maybe if your dog was the total package .

I never seen these kinds of dogs myself Iam just going by my own experince with hog hunting and what I know to be true .  I can see how someone said it is not easy breeding these types of dogs and I would think they are few and far between the real ones.  My dogs are what I thought about as ruff as they come because we have caught and legged many a hogs from 225 to around 290 but I just cant see just one of my dogs doing this by himself .

Anyway good luck I will stick to my style  even tho I would love to see those kinds of dogs work some day just to say I seen it with my own eyes.

TexasHogDogs

Jim

I have a great dane/pit male I'm hoping to turn into a RCD. I try to hunt very close range dogs. All I and the RCD's need is to hear a bark, grunt or squel. If they are close enough then you and the RCD can hopefully get there in time with the catch dog before anyone gets hurt. I've never hunted in Texas but I know some places here in Georgia where the hogs don't bay, they just run so even then a RCD is worthless. I think the ideal place for a running catch dog is when the hogs have SOME experience with dogs. A friend of mine hunts with 8 dogs running loose and too pits. His dogs hunt close range and are extremely gritty. He catches more hogs than me but also buys more staples than me. Where I am hunting determines what I take. I prefer a loose baydog, one or two RCD's and a pit. It is really good if the RCD stays close to the strike dog so it can catch what the strike dog finds. Sometimes too many ruff dogs can be bad especially in the thick stuff. In the open a dog has room to move around and swing off of the big hogs. Most of our hurt dogs have come in thick stuff with a pack of dogs. Just my 3 cents !

Thats the best way you could had put it

i hunt places where all the hogs there break, thats when it makes me regret not breeding my bulldog to a greyhound. i have caught hogs that tried to break and my rcds just grabbed them on the ear or nose and held on until the catch dogs got there, but there have been those times where the hog broke, and just flat out ran my rcds till they were so tired they had to come back

Its a very efficient way to catch hogs, especially runners.  That's all michelle mears of florida would own.  If it bayed she got rid of it.  She swore that hogs on her lease would never bay up and without an enduro dog which is what she called them you'd never catch one.  She vested all her dogs and they all got cut all the time but rarely killed.  I had a lab/pit that would hunt with any cur or hound  , would hunt long range, cross any water or thick woods, hell of a nose and hang on all day.  I've said this a thousand times, if you bypass the bay you will catch more hogs.  

I have had dogs and have hunted with dogs that would find and catch. 99% of the time it wasn't a good thing or didn't turn out well.

Also, as Chris said... since when do RCD have to find and catch hogs? ???


This is a very debatable paragraph as a whole in my opinion.

If I remember correctly... it was not long ago that you posted a video of a dog that caught a hog. After there were some very negative reviews of the way the dog was caught you said some thing along the lines of... all you expect a dog to do is hold a hog long enough for you to kill it.

Now you are saying "dog should dance like a boxer with both eyes open watching the hog and there suroundings". That is quite the contradiction from a couple months ago.

There are pleanty of bulldogs out there that would strike hogs if you trained them to and would catch. No matter how well the dog caught, how much vest you put on them... one day that dog would meet its maker. There is always a bigger and badder hog out there.

I use 3 big ole ridgeback that will find and catch and and old walker/ cur that is rough as hell to let me know where they are at i have two that I know could go one out I just don't chance it but have done it.

One thing I don't understand why folks give Josh so much crap when he posts he a good guy that hunts hard hell his wife loves to hunt so in short why don't yall back the hell off!

The key to the rcd which stands for running catch dog, which means the dog finds the hog and then catches it, is to use cut collars and vests and get to the dogs as fast as possible.  Most of the times you'll hear the grunt, squeal or fight.  In my opinion its the most efficient way to catch hogs especially runners.  The dog doesn't bay or bark so the hog doesn't get a chance to escape.  If you use more than one and they're use to hunting together then they'll just pile on.  Most people that haven't hunted much like this will always disagree.  Michelle mears kept a kennel full of these dogs and she wrote for boar hunter magazine.  Her dogs were dogo/catahoula, pit/leopard, foundation bmc, straight pit, and other crosses but they would all hunt deep and run to catch.  The lab/pit that I had made most other dogs look weak and stupid.  Be sure to break your dogs off stock(cows, horses, goats,etc) completely before going to the woods.  I made that mistake once and things got ugly. 

I understand what Josh is talking about, its another style of hunting, with a differant style of dog is all.

I have some intrest in the finder/holder myself, this is not a RCD like ya'll are thinking about. It will not work everywhere. No body seems to be trying to talk anybody into doing it. And many don't understand anything about them. He is talking about clasic Austrailian style finder/ holders( I believe), that does not mean "One out" dogs.

I hunt two ways, one is for fun, I load up my bay dogs and a catch dog and go hunting like everyone else.

But while I am working, checking cattle, feeding, fencing going to and from I like to have two dogs on the truck that I can drop on hogs that they can see or wind, I want those dogs to track by sight, sent, and sound and catch asap. We are over run with hogs in my country and while I am working I need to be able to catch some hogs quick and get back to work. I have alot of neighbors that are having big hog problems and need some help. They are not crazy about droping 4-5 bay dogs in a pasture and chasing pigs everywhere, but droping two dogs that will run and catch is a little differant deal.

I can see a time in the near future where alot of ranchers and farmers in west Texas will be buying and using  pairs of finder/holder type dogs to do a job. They are not in it for the fun of the hunt, they want to kill the hogs that are eating them out of house and home.

For example: I am checking wheat pasture cattle horseback and I am pulling a trailer with two horses. I am driving between pastures and as I pull up to the next place I see a sounder running off the wheat with a big boar bringing up the rear. Now I don't want to turn out 3-4 baydogs and follow up with a catch dog and hope they can stop the big boar before he ends up on the neighbors place a mile away. I want to be able to drop two dogs that can run a mile and catch the boar, then back to work.

Just my two cents, HAHA

Now if ya'll want to jump on me for that, then go right ahead, HAHA

Thank,
Paul T

Ninja,

When I am referring to a RCD, I am talking about a catch dog that is running loose either near me, or with the strike dogs. bulldog, cur, or any cross...Just no bay, all catch.  I expect the strike dogs to find the hog, and the RCD to catch the hogs.

I think what you and I are calling RCD are two different dogs... difference is yours finds hogs, mine does not.

The way we use an RCD now is as a short ranged dog that runs loose but stays near us, yeah they can and will find a pig sometimes but for the most part they are just out to catch or shut down runners.

The best one I had personally I got rid of because I didn't realize that was really his job and he was damn good at it, I was trying to make a strike dog out of him and he just didn't have the range or nose for that kind of work, lol

Always an interesting topic and usually gets a lot of responses, good or bad, seems it it split down the middle on the use of them. To me a RCD is what it is, a running catch dog. If you just use bulldogs or dogs similar (one out types) that to me is a strike dog, unless your spot-lighting and dropping them off a truck or 4 wheeler when spotting a group.

I maybe wrong though, I'm just a wannabe.... ;D

I've had bulldogs and bulldog crosses that would run a mile to the bay and catch or you could walk them in to a bay and catch.  If you saw a hog you could turn that dog to the hog and it would catch it.    To me and in my opinion those are just catch dogs and every catch dog does that for me or gets culled.  What most people refer to as running catch dogs are strike dogs or one out dogs or enduro dogs that catch hogs and do not bay.  They can be any cross or purebred as long as they find and catch the hog.  If you're having to use a strike dog first that bays and then turning the catch dog loose then thats just simply a catch dog. 

RCD= running catch dog, not catching strike dog. A running catch dogs job is to run loose and catch just like a catch dog on a lead but running loose. A strike dog that catches is a catching strike dog. Any dog can come across a hog in the woods but that doesn't mean they are a strike dog. A running catch dog shouldn't actively hunt, just run loose and catch what the strike dogs find. Makes sense to me.

Thats the way I have always thought Buddylee.

TexasHogDogs

Jim

That's exactly how we use my bulldog.  She is a running catch dog, as in she runs loose and immediately runs to any bay in earshot.  She has occasionally caught a few hogs on her own without a strike dog finding them first but her job in our pack is to run loose and catch hogs when they are bayed up or to shut down any runners. That's my definition of a running catch dog(rcd).

you stir up more trouble than our new president.  L3 we need to come back down there or when you go to mavs give me a call might make a run down there too we can hunt panther creek oh waid nvm dont have a rcd right now but have a good cur and a good help dog that is starting to find his own hogs lol

IMO if you need a RCD then run one. When I got into hog hunting I bought a dog off a fella that was honest with me told me her quirks (very catchy but needs help) She finds allot of hogs but she will try to catch so she needs a RCD or a rough cur with her at all times other wise you are going for a race.

Basy dogs??? Never seen one in action. LOL all my dogs catch on sight.

I'd like to try a mastiff/dane cross... Allot of Aussie hunters use them and they do great as finders holders type dogs.. anyone on here use them or have tried them?

I hunted behind one, I couldn't hear the bay cause his breathing was so loud. Solid dog just to much dog, a pit or cur can do the same job with half the food bill.LOL

Reading old threads and saw this one. My main problem with big dogs or "one out" is they are horrible in brush I'm sorry but I have never seen a Great Dane or for that fact any big dog that can keep up at all in thick brush. Also they have to be the worst at crossing fences. Where I hunt we have 5 wire barbed wire fences and in some places 6. So until you get that monster to jump over a fence. I don't find much use for them in my woods.

I ran a full blooded pit for a long time by himself. Caught a good bit of hogs with him solo. My buddy has a bird bull/ Campbell cross that is a very long range dog and its maybe 50lbs if not 40 and he is a one out dog. Has the heart of a catchdog gets cut up a lot but he's still going strong just a matter a time

ohhhh tha memories ... i often wonder .... whatever hapened to l3 , bigl and toothless old hound ..... sniff sniff   ;)



                oh well i guess we'll here back from them sooner or later  :) :)

I agree with you on what a rcd is. You don't expect your walk in catch dog to find a hog, so why should your rcd find one

When I am referring to a RCD, I am talking about a catch dog that is running loose either near me, or with the strike dogs. bulldog, cur, or any cross...Just no bay, all catch.  I expect the strike dogs to find the hog, and the RCD to catch the hogs.
I think what you and I are calling RCD are two different dogs... difference is yours finds hogs, mine does not.
[/quote]
I agree with you on what a rcd is. You don't expect your walk in catch dog to find a hog, so why should your rcd find one
[/quote]

Thought dogos were supposed to find and catch?

Asking not instigating ^

I believe toothless old still trolls the boards from time to time.  :laugh:
I miss his stories too and sure do wish he'd chime in every once In a while!!

Too each his own. I have some big dogs. No they can't run thru brush quite as fast but even small dogs can't keep up with a 50 lb pig in briars.

I agree with you on what a rcd is. You don't expect your walk in catch dog to find a hog, so why should your rcd find one
[/quote]

Thought dogos were supposed to find and catch?
[/quote]

I'll be the first to tell you Dogos don't have the best nose. We have one female that will pick up on one that's close but that's it. But there's a breeder who uses an all Dogo pack in Argentina who finds hogs with them.

I have yet to own a Dogo that can't find it's own hog. Granted I have only had five. In fact, I used to hunt, and catch quite a few hogs, with just a Dogo. Even out in dry places like Lubbock. When o went to lubbock, the only dog i took with me was my Soco dog, and he found plenty out there. In my opinion, if the Dogos ain't findin their own hogs, and that is what they are supposed to do, they are culls. I don't care how good they catch. I can go get a pit that will hang on as good as a Dogo. Now that I am in a position to have more dogs, the Dogos are more of a passion than necessity for me, but they still better be able to find their own hog, or they are gonna get culled.

Guess my Dogos are culls then

As you have described them, yes they are.

I don't use my Dogos to find hogs I use them to catch them. . And they do it pretty damn well. So no, my dogs aren't culls

I thought the whole point of the dogo was that all you had to run was dogos and they'd find and catch? Thus the ridiculous prices

They have an outrageous price because not every back yard breeder has them yet. Unlike every other person breeding pits

Lol yeah know one gets on here some talk to a couple buddys that are no longer members or more like lost their password and they get on here and read some

According to everything I've read pertaining the original goals of Antonio Nores Martinez the dogo was bred
 to first find the hogs, and then catch them. If your so set on helping the breed, and proving them to be true hunting dogs why wouldn't you be following the original breed standards at least. You should be holding your dogos to the highest standards possible not settling for mediocrity.

Your the one who brought it up, and described your dogs. They are culls, but you can call them whatever you want, and you can use them how ever you want, but that does not change the facts. There are to many Dogo's, like you describe, being bred and spread around. I have owned some like that, they were culls and were culled, no hunt and no nose. That is not what the Dogo was designed to be. Please do not breed any of that blood.

My dogs are not culls. My Dogos are bred from some of the best bloodlines you can get. And they do what I need them to do. Which is to be a rcd. But I'm not going to sit here and defend my dogs to someone who has never hunted with them.

Not trying to pick a fight, but this is the exact problem with the dogo. People pay high dollar for "the best bloodlines you can get", and then settle for mediocrity because they have so much money invested. According to breed standards your dogs are culls if they don't find their own hogs. Plain and simple. So how are you going to help prove their abilities as hunting dogs, and improve the breed if your own dogs can't even meet the MINIMUM breed standard? Bloodlines and price tags don't make a dog, abilities do. If you really want to help the breed out, make them prove themselves and except only the best.

when i walk hunt chuy is rcd. when im roading or other  just catching

from me.....who else. tapatalk

and dont forget dogos are used for protection, police work. world wide...dont compare pits to dogos...yes there pricey and us who have them dont complain...but if you want to cull my boy its on you...just make shure you make a solid point...cuz the one you are making now... well like football to soccer....WORLDWIDE STAGE HOMMIE

from me.....who else. tapatalk

ask mr.mason about Chuy...i will call him a cull if he does

from me.....who else. tapatalk

This is Kane. He is my RCD. He will find his own hog and catch it. That to me is a running catch dog. If one of the other dogs strike he goes with them until he gets close enough to catch. If they get split up he will catch what he gets to. if its piglets he will kill the one he catches and head to the nearest bay. If its a piglet he kills it and goes to the next. (http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/04/05/u7ese4e7.jpg)

??? I think your missing the point.... police work and personal protection has nothing to do with being a catch dog. And pits? Where'd that even come from HOMMIE? The price is what it is. I'm not knocking that because I have payed for dogos. Just don't hold them to lower standards, because you did pay that much for them. Also I'm not saying everyone who has a dogo that doesn't find hogs should cull the dog on the spot. Just don't breed it, and especially don't breed it and say your helping the breed.

In a nutshell, it's simple don't breed dogs that can't even meet the minimum breed standard, and claim to be helping the breed.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

After reeding other post I will add I run rough dogs with Kane. The rest will bay will get rough but when Kane sinks teeth they all pile on. A perfect example was Kane and my lady dog got on a boar hog while going to a bay. They caught the boar and we killed it then they went on to the bay. The dogs at the bay were catchy dogs but this big Barr had them backed up. When Kane got to them he caught and that dude was stretched in no time. I don't like running Kane one out and if possible I don't do it. That doesn't mean tho that he don't get split up from the rest. He also actively hunts and very often is the lead dog when just searching. My other dogs do pick up a lil older track than him but he can wind as good as any of them.

To me these dogs that just run along side of wheeler are catch dogs without a leash. Why not load them up and send them when u hear a bay instead of letting them run along side getting tired. A guy I hunt with has a pit that rides loose on the box. If the dogs bay he tells him to go to them and he's gone. 400 yards 200yards 600 don't matter if he can hear them he is gone. If the hog breaks before he gets to it he can and will follow until either he catches up or it stops to bay.then it's caught hog.

Blood lines only say what a dog SHOULD be, they don't make a dog. The dog has to do that on its own.

Lets say someone reads the breed standard and decides they want a Dogo, because they will find and catch hogs on their own. They come to you and buy some of your dogs. They go to the woods and the dogs never find a hog, ever. Do you think that person is gonna turn around and talk about how good the Dogo is? Hell no, if they have any balls, their gonna step up, cull the dogs and cut their losses, then probably never say a good word about a Dogo the rest of their life.

Tell me this, if the Doc who created this breed, wanted dogs that found hogs, do you think he would have bred your dogs?

Let me give you a hint, your dogs don't find hogs, so the answer is No!

This right here, ladies and gentlemen, is why there are so many number 2 eatin Dogos. Mediocrity...

What's his background? Sounds like a good one

im going to start another post about culling...

from me.....who else. tapatalk

I have no idea. I got him from a guy in Shreveport LA named Jeffry Glenn. He had got it somewhere. When I got him I was told he would catch but didn't have a nose. I don't think he had learned to use it yet. The bad part for me is he is cut so I won't be getting any pups of him so he is a one show pony. Wish I had 3 more just like him.

Like

here is my back ground...ive never hunted with dogs..never hunted pigs...untill i got a dogo..he does hunt AND catches.by himself..i dont see the point in culling a dogo because thay dont hunt as well as another...some people want a dogo for a pet...actually out of my CHUYS litter he is the only one who hunts..and culling needs to be for generations to weed out defects. GENERATIONS... years of good culling with several dogs of great blood (proven)  and i just dont see that happining...in most cases but i do feel that most rcd here on this board do a great job. they have the experience and the handler. ive seen it. this is the same as cat vs. bmc.......cant we all get along. lol;D;D

from me.....who else. tapatalk

or....lets go hunt. im willing, any one else...

from me.....who else. tapatalk

I usually go a few times a week. Come on up.

Ya but %99 of pits will catch odds with dogos from what I've read not as high as pits. But because there's fewer dogos theyre more valuable?

I've decided to breed my own version of Dogo's. Ain't no way I'm paying a grand for a dog that may catch. I think I can breed up a 65-75lb dog that will hunt and catch.

Dodgegirl, I have had my fun in the past poking at dogo owners, including you. I believe you know that I have not and do not mean any disrespect to you or other dogo owners, as we have poked at each other back and forth about dogs in general for a while, I do and have enjoyed reading the posts about your dogs and wish you the best of luck. If I were in your shoes I would let  these posts be water off a ducks back, if you like the dogs then hunt them, BUT I will have to say that what I have highlighted is some dang good advice (it doesn't really matter at the end of the day who says what about your dogs but if you want to be the best you gotta breed the best), not just for you but for anyone looking to breed any breed of dogs for the better, stay true to the line mam and you will be in high cotton!

L3 outdoors.... My buddy bought a pup from Daniel casas... She was out of ammo and Harely..that would make it 1/2 great Dane 1/4 pit 1/4 bmc is what Daniel said... He breed her to a full ybmc... (http://i1173.photobucket.com/albums/r588/crossstock/94E85B8F-0CC2-4DDB-8EC6-081BC46A128F-438-00000108246D8B6B.jpg)this is what we have now 5/8 bmc 1/4 great Dane 1/8 pit.... Should shut a hog down...

cool I would like that verry much. how do you typically hunt?

from me.....who else. tapatalk

i tried to introduce my wifes cane corso to a pig. mr. mason told me to take him away,let him be a puppy, then bring him back...he died from a weird autoimmune disease. he was one of the most beautiful dogs ever seen. and he would go out of his way to go look for my kids. my wife still tears up looking at pictures of him

from me.....who else. tapatalk

kinda sounds like these  type  dogs never miss  or  get out run hahahaha  we all get out run ......  even  L 3  in the tv shows i seen got out run lost hogs and used another find baydog to find em .....  if you just run catchdogs i call em   you'll get em killed perty regular  if they find very far off or all cut up  not to mention heat stroked  .......  most peoples baydogs catch small hogs 80 pounds like a strait out bulldog  ....   no wonder the hogs  is  takeing over ..... if you just want to kill em  hunt one easy baydog that want run one  far  and  carry  you a  shotgun loaded with buckshot  i bet  sometimes  you kill  a  truck load at a time ....i just  hunt  cause  i like  too  .....  but  i could make  em scarce  if  i wanted  too ...

Blah, Blah, Blah.... Too many variables to argue over RCD's.

1st you have to agree on a solid definition of a Running Catch Dog, that unanimously everybody can agree on to even start this arguement. Since everyones definition is different then you will never have a solid answer. ... Now why is everyones opinion different you ask?

We hunt different terrains and different hogs.

South Ga, a RCD is any Breed of dog that will hunt his/her own hogs, will not let out a single bark, and will catch. Period. What works good, different terrain requires different dogs. It all boils down to what produces best for you.

So, L3 by YOUR stated def of RCD's, I have 1

Here in middle Georgia a dog that finds and catches any hog is just straight catch strike dog. A RCD is a dog that runs loose and catches versus a walkin catch dog.

See the difference in 2 parts of the same state. My point exactly

These days we don't even call em RCDs anymore. There's too much confusion with exactly what kind of dog we're talking about. It's hard enough getting ppl to except the fact that our dogs do what we say they do. We just call em Finder/holders or OneOuts . A dog only gets called a OneOut in our yard if it can be expected to hold any pig it may come accross. Usually I sell a dog cause its not fitting the bill, not meeting expectations, or not suitable for breeding, I tell the buyer what they're getting they try to talk me down on price in disbelief. So to get the dog gone and in a hunting home I might take a little less. About a week or two later I get a call stateing exactly what I said the dog would do and do I want sell some more of my dogs. Mine and L3s dogs find and catch pigs and live to do it every hunt. Plain and simple. Your dog has to have big b.lls and so does the man handling them to trust they're not gona die. If a dog in my pack bays it get culled. Meaning it gets sent down the road to someone else that can use it.

Just so I'm clear here, did you just say you sell your culls?

Ones persons culls is anothers best dog lol

lol

True , true.....SOMETIMES

What cut gear you runnin?

And yes, I sell my culls.

1. Registered Bluetick Gyp-1yr old    Sold for $100 to coonhunter for breedingand papers. Hog broke her young.
2. Blue nose Pit- 1yr Old                 Sold for $100 To another hog hunter Who leads in. I expect mine to hunt as well not just a lead in.
3. Catahoula- 6 months old             Sold for $200 to fellow Hog hunter. Would not do squat in bay pen, littermates love a hog made her look dumb. She was merle with Glass eyes.

 Looks sold her. But i did clarify to buyer how she does in pen even gave her a test drive in my pen to prove it. Why? Let me guess you just shoot your culls? Why not try to make money off of them. If your honest about the dog before hand and buyer still wants then why should you deny??

Sorry Mrs Lousiana, I thought Centex Asked me what i did with my culls sarcastically, i was skimmin and thats what i get lol sorry.

Wow. Thats all I can say.

If it wasn't for culls I wouldn't have a dog.  :) It can be frustrating but some will still make a dog. Every dog I have I got from someone that didn't like something about them. One was to rough. One was crazy and wouldn't hunt out far enough and checked in to often. One kept trying to climb out the bay pen. The last one the guy wanted to start running loose dogs and a RCD didn't fit in and he was to much trouble to lead in.

Lol

Mrs. Louisiana
That's exactly what Im saying. I put a lot of time and patients into my dogs. Sometimes years trying to bring out the dogs potential that I see in it. There comes a time when decisions must be made and time has proved the obvious, that the dog in question is not cut out for the job being asked of it. In this case Striking and Catching come hell or high water, stand in his or her guts hardness and still hold so I can get there to kill the hog and save the dog. Some of the dogs I try just don't have it when it comes right down to it. I'm trying to create a line of dogs with hunt drive, intelligence, and stand in the guts hardness. Bottom line when they don't meet those criteria I send them down the road and someone gets a pretty darn good dog.

No worries...... :)

I hear you, totally. I guess it really all boils down to personal beliefs. We don't let too many dogs leave our yard, but when they do, they go to hard working homes, where they will be put to the test. The rare times we do any breeding, we too have certain expectations for said offspring as they mature. We too put alot of work, time and money into our dogs. When the time comes, if a dog doesn't make the cut, I feel that being *I* created said dog with a purpose, it is my responsibility to cull them. Now, if there is a special circumstance where maybe I feel said dog may do very well on another type of game, or in another terrain, I will attempt to place the dog with someone who can utilize the dog, but if I feel that the dog is a cull through and through, I will do what needs to be done. I find that as my responsibility. It all depends on the specific dog, and what it is or is not lacking. I'm just personally not a fan of passing on a dog that I consider a cull. I think the confusion/debate on the subject of culling stems from the fact that alot of folks have a different defination of the word "cull" and what it means exactley.

~Krystale~
The word cull is pretty broad anyway. It kind of needs defining on an individual basis. Expl. A Whitetail high fence cull may be a 150 class buck, but on my wall it looks pretty good to me. In my yard I may have Catdo or an English pointer that's highly trained, great at finding hogs and gets out to thousand yards. But if that dog backs up and bays for me it's a cull. However that's a damn good strike dog to somebody else. A turd is turd. And you can't polish one. That kind of dog never leaves. I apologize if I'm beating this to death, just trying to clarify.

Right on. Depends on the context in which the word is being used.

A turd is indeed a turd....haha....I like that

Here is another question. If one of y'all have a dog that isn't up to your par but for someone else it may fit their style or atleast be a good addition. Why not have it cut then send it on. This would prevent others from getting ur blood and ensure the cull u passed on was not bred. Like this that man is getting one dog not a bloodline that he could spread bad dogs from.

Excellent idea. I plan to do the same.

What? I can understand a Catdo, but a pointer really? ew thats gross, almost as bad as a walker.....

Also centex, Your dogs that rough what cut gear you run?

Lol
Yeah I have one right now, and he's a great dog but not hard enough. 
I run a combination of Aussie gear and a similar American version my buddy makes called a hairy holder. The Aussie stuff is Duncan's, Pigga Frigga, and JS Enterprises. The Holders are just as we'll crafted and local with a few customizations( or upgrades) the Aussies take a real minimalist view on cut gear so he's added a few things like jaw flaps and wider girth straps. They're made primarily out of seatbelt. They take alot of hits and very seldom even get a poke thru. If the dog holds clean there's not much to worry about.

I have 1 Duncan plate and 1 Pigga Frigga plate.

Dont believe i've ever seen that stuff. I'm gonna do some research thanks!

I do like your comment, "If the dog holds clean, theres not much to worry about" We hardly ever used cut gear around here. Kinda behind times i guess. (just got a trackin system here recently) But Buddy of mine had a game bred pit, about 50lbs or so and when he would catch, he would roll up under the hog stay there caught till you broke him off. You would get there and only see the hog standing there with his head cocked. Kinda sketchy at first.

Hunted a pit and a jack russel together for a long time. Caught alot of hogs that way. Never wore cut vest his entire life.

Good for the summer time as they are not as hot as regular catch vest. My dogs run loose but u still have watch them.