EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

I have never really had much trouble trash breaking dogs. So I don't have much experience in doing it. Other than my skunk killing catch dog. None of mine are trashy not really worried about the catch dog cause I keep her up until. Bayed. But I got a 1/2 pit 1/2 bmc and I have a feeling she is going to be hard to break, so I'm planning. On buying. A shock collar for her cause I really have a lot of interest. In her cause of the dogs she's out of and how good she bays.I don't take her to the woods but have showed. Her hogs.  She Bayes. Her. Ass off she's 9 months old my question is when should I begin the shocking. Cause I know for a fact she will bark at cows which is a huge no no in the. Places I hunt this dog has a lot of go and grit but I'm worried. If I shock her when she's to young that she won't work for me.

well i started breaking mine right before i planned on actually hunting them . take um and let them bay some pigs then to the cow lot and when they wanted to bay the cows i'd burn um , never say nothing just burn um , then back to the pig pen to let them bay a little  . couple of times like that they figure it out  . pigs good cows bad lol

I like what you said...

Trash breaking is not something you, "go do". If anybody acts like it is they are talkin, and dont know what the hell they're talkin about. Sometimes its not an issue, sometimes it takes years to "finish". The only way to really do it is run your young dogs with trash broke dogs, and keep as much control of them as possible for as long as you can. I wouldnt run a young dog right off the bat. Keep it with you until dogs bay a few times, and turn it to the bay at first. That is a good start

i will agree to disagree with ya ! not that i know everything , but it is the hunters responsibility to ensure their dogs are not after the wrong game . i have had dogs that were very persistent about chasing deer. the only way ive been successful with breaking them is to use the same methods that mr.whitten (halfbreed)has described. i also feel that turning pups to a bay is good and bad.yes , it shows them the proper game but on the other hand your teaching them to wait for a bay!!!so to each there own . be a responceable hunter cuz there are too many folks out there that are ruining it for us!!   

well said dog !!  my dogs will be STOCK BROKE  before they are ever hunted  bawlmouth what a crock of B S  . you know why when you ask permiission to hunt a ranch and the rancher says hell no you ain;t bringig dogs in here , it's because of people with your mindset . if you don't know how to trash break a dog don't tell people that it is not a go do deal . it should be a priortity to every dog hunter around . you young guy's break your dogs off of stock before you hit the woods . there is no such thing as a natural hog dog that only works hogs , there are on the other hand natural stock dogs that will want to work everything in the woods   GEEZZ PLEEASE  this post just made my friggin day  lmbao the rest the day

Hahahahaha some responses on here never get old  ;D

I did the same as half breed , My buddy has cows so I took my bulldog there and put a 20ft lead on him and walked threw the cows , he got down and was going to get one and I put the elec. to him , I had the rope just in case the elec. didnt work I still had some control , this method worked for me , the shock collar is a good thing for training but also you can over do it also and maybe set your dog back

being someone who owns/leases 70,000+ acres on which I run hunts and straighten out yearling, and have 750+ mother cows, nonw of which is inherited, I dont believe I'll worry too much about what you think will or will not please a landowner where you want to hunt. I offered him some advice about letting his dogs learn from other dogs, not what people he does not know tells him. B.S or not, I catch hogs, on my places, and other peoples, all my dogs ARE stock and deer BROKE, and it'll be a cold day in hell before you will have spent as much time in the woods in your whole life, as I have by age 30. On this continent or any other.Learn who your talkin to before you point BS at me redneck east tx old man.

Anyway, TD3, back to what I meant, You can not just go and shock the pi$$ out of your dogs around something and call it good. If you can, your dogs dont havemuch drive. My best dogs will kill an armadillo on a real slow night, just cause theres nothing else to do. Like I said, anybody who acts like they can "SHORE NUFF BREAK 'AT OL SOMBUCK" by goin and doin a little session, doesnt know what the hell thy're talking about. Take it or leave it makes no difference.

i call b.s. when i hear it . we DOG MEN  been trash breaking dogs as a part of training for hundreds of years , and i don't think we was talking . and actually i am from the central plains , but yes my neck is red from being out in the sun hunting all my life . i don't give a hoot how many cows or how much land you got . you got your own land and cows  well good for you , but these folks where i am at are real picky about letting a bunch of trashy dogs rum amuck thru THEIR cattle . and what you actually said was anybody that says they trash break their dogs is just blowing smoke , correct me if i'm wrong . and as far as time in the woods , that has been my whole entire lifetime training and breaking scent hounds . if you are older than me your last couple of sentences might be true . so do i know what i am talking about on trash breaking as you stated [  anybody that does say they do this don't know what they talkin about  lol ]    well you damn skippy i do , and if it sometimes takes you years to accomplish this act , well nuff said on that  lol and i just noticed something about 30 is that how old you are ?  still wet behind the ears  lol good day to you sir .  I SAID GOOD DAY  LOL

breaking most dogs is not that hard if you are consistent and know what you are doing...Like it was previously mentioned a pup that is held up with you most of the night and only turned loose in to a bay will get on hogs and that helps the pup to strike hogs...but the pup might also learn to stay by your side because you insisted he does that and he learned that well...Then you turn him loose to hunt because you feel he is ready for that next step and the first thing he sees is a deer and he runs it and you holler and shock the dog pretty hard...Well the pup might get broke off of deer but it is very possible that the pup might associate the pain in his neck with running off in the woods so now he will not leave your side unless the dogs bay a pig...and then you get rid of the pup because he won't get out from under your feet...that is one scenario of many...

I break super gamy pups off of deer before they go in the woods and try to do the same with cows...but I make sure the pups have been on a few mock hunts on hogs or in the bay pen and doing good baying hogs...after they know what a pig is I add deer scent to a white cloth or paper towel and tack it to a deer shoulder mount and walk in to the kennel and go after the alpha pup...and light him up when the deer touches him...I use a cattle prod and repeat same step with the other pups...I come back a week later and do it again...A few days later I do it a third time but only one love tap...the first 2 times it is at least 3 hits back to back and on the third time they will be looking to climb walls and urinating on themselves...these pups are about deer broke and might need a reminder in a month or 2 for just one round...if breaking these gamy pups in the woods it will be frustrating and a long process because I have to be for sure it is a deer and not a hog...The more they run the deer the harder they are to break them off of deer...just nip it in the bud and it will make life easier for all involved...

Like I said before...the most important trash breaking is livestock and deer...

About to be another smart ass cullin'...

I'm about fed up with the folks who can't hold a decent conversation.

If I even had access to 70,000 acres I wouldnt be sittin here readin this crap must be nice.Im just an old redneck to my dogs are trash broke blood trackers broke in the ways mentioned.Where did your daddy have yours trash broke

Hope mines not too outa line just found bm a littlle offensive

I dont know my daddy smart ass, like I said, none of what i have was inherited. And if you must know, the reason im not out plantin oats right this minute, is cause I have my yr old son at home cause his mom is in the hospital. Like I said, know who your talkin to b4 you point somethin at them

Im 22years young and don't know half of what I want to, that being said all you GROWN MEN need to learn how to have semi civilized debate/argument or use the pm function. Before you reply, you better learn who you're talkin too!(;

Sincerely, young gun who just leaned to tie his shoes, matching feet is the hard part now O0

T-trash break
R-reinforce good behavior
A-accept the dog for what he is
I-interact with the dog
N-nutrition
E-exercise
R-repeat

Doesn't answer the question but let's see what changes y'all come up with

i wanted to say more but exercised better judgement .....i suggest the same for others! tongue tied....

Bawl mouth Id liked to konw more about your huntin operation and how you aquired your land.Im asking this in a sincire and respectful manner.Never to old to learn something new.

TDS Im no expert but i would go with your gut feeling. If you think she's gona trash put her in that situation & be ready to correct it. I believe for a young dog its part of growing and sometimes trashing on a animal should not be seen as all negative. I think a shock colar should do the trick.

Maybe get one with a beep function? Tri tronics makes some good ones, I think sportsog makes a cheaper version. It does wonders on some dogs....

Anybody know how much were talking ( money)

I use a tri-tronics classic 70 exp. Cost about $320 with one collar. It has served me well on hog dogs, bird dogs, and blood trackers. Very reliable and durable. Im of the opinion you dont really want to skimp on E-collars, you'll end up buying 3 cheap ones,when one good one would have lasted and saved you in the end.

P.S. extra collars are $120 I think, but you can get factory referbs at cabelas bargain bins for half

I would go with the tri tronics. Sometimes you can find a good deal on Ebay, craigslist, ETHD, etc.

Put them on pigs then what ever you want them to break off then pigs. I always just break them off cattle and deer at first. All the small critters come from being in the field with a shock collar on not many land owners will gripe about small critters around here but deer and cattle Is a big No. It might not be the right way and it works for me. Hope this helps

It has been my experience when using a shock collar is to light that ass up. No beeper mode, no starting out on low, just light their ass up
on high from the start. It has never took more than one or two sessions at most to get the point across. A lot of folks won't agree with this method but it has worked for me. The most important thing is the dog must not associate the pain with you. I don't holler "NO" or
"QUIT" before I hit the button. When the dog breaks for the livestock hit the button.

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 A Friendly Reminder by John Wick

Most folks know that TRI-TRONICS is now owned by GARMIN. Since that historic event occurred, and even for a couple of years before it was finalized, smart people from both companies were working on a shared vision. Not only did these two companies feel they had a great idea and improvement in mind (and more ideas are in the works), but dog owners, especially hunting dog owners and trainers, have dreamed of this type of product for many years. So what do you get when the world’s leading E-collar company marries the world’s leading GPS dog tracking company, and they have a baby? Alpha 100! It is a combination of its two parents. The very best of both worlds in one package. Dog tracking and locating better than it’s ever been done before, and remote training better and farther than it’s ever been done before. Wow! Both on one collar! Both operated with one handheld! The Alpha 100 is a major technological achievement, and a fantasy come true for all who work or play with active dogs.
 
Here’s what I want to remind all of us about. Most of us do know this, but it’s something we and others may temporarily forget in our excitement to use this new product. You see, all of us who have used various types of dog locating equipment never needed to be concerned about our dog becoming accustomed to the collar before using it on our favorite canine partner. And most of us realize that an E-collar is a different story. It’s critically important that we spend a week or ten days getting our dogs accustomed to the weight and feel of that pronged collar before we actually put it to stimulation use. Not doing so inevitably leads to a “collar-wise” dog. Collar-wise means a few different things and a few different types of reactions depending on the dog and its experiences. However, collar-wise is always a bad and unwanted thing, and it is almost always something that leaves behind negative side effects that we must then deal with for the rest of that dog’s life.
 
Here’s the thing. When you get a new Alpha, it’s fine to strap it on your dog and after an hour or so of the dog feeling the weight and smelling the new scent, you’re ready to go and do the tracking and locating part of the Alpha. However, I strongly advise against doing any stimulation with the E-collar buttons until your dogs are thoroughly accustomed to feeling those prongs while working, playing, rambling, and roaming for at least part of half-a-dozen days or trips.
 
The other reminder I’m thinking of is that we’re accustomed to having dog locating collars on our dog at about medium tightness around their neck. However, if we’re going to use the Alpha to stimulate our dog when needed, those prongs—just like with all E-collars before it—need to be snug and making excellent contact with the skin of the dog’s throat area—right behind their head. Putting the Alpha on loosely and farther back on the neck will result in fine dog locating experiences but very poor dog stimulation results.
 
Using the stimulation feature of this new product before your dog is completely accustomed to this new scent and to feeling those two prongs rubbing its throat may cause you to lose the ability to use your Alpha as an E-collar. That’s because after they’re “collar-wise” or “collar-shy,” you usually have a dog on your hands that either won’t get out from under your feet; or as soon as you turn it loose, it’ll run back to your vehicle and want to get in or under it; or your dog will very tentatively and timidly kind of hang around and mess around but not really do anything good or bad because it’s unsure of why each of the first few times it wore this collar it got zapped. Those too soon shocking events clearly indicated to your dog that this collar is a serious problem, instead of the dog more gradually learning that some its behaviors are a problem. Done slower and more carefully, it never even realizes that this pronged collar delivered a corrective message.
 
As always, keep in mind that patience pays big and productive dividends. Not being patient and thinking like your dog always causes bad results, no matter what kind of dog owns you.
 
I’ll see you here next month to share more thoughts.
 
John Wick

Tags: collar-wise, e-collar, John Wick, training
.

ABOUT JOHN WICK – John is known to thousands of hunters as “Uncle John” because of his life-long efforts to help and encourage others. Though he’s owned and enjoyed all types of hunting dogs, John is nationally known for his 46 years experience with tree dogs. For approximately 25 years, he made all or most of his living breeding, training, and competing coonhounds in Missouri.

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sorry for such space  lol i'm trying to master copieing and paisting  lol . it's hard for an old east texas redneck to master this new technology lol

Lol, couldnt help but go back and re-read all that. Where did anybody get the Idea that I said dont trash break your dogs???????? If you'll go back and read, It ought to be easy to understand I was impying that it DOES NOT HAPPEN OVER NIGHT. Reason I go back and say it again is the same reason I said what I said in the first place, which is....... I think it shows poor judgment to teach someone asking advice on trashbreaking that if they'll go shock their dog around somethin a few times, they can assume the dog is BROKE. If you dont think they'll try one when they're outa sight some day........... I image youd be mistaken. Take whichever advice makes sense to you i suppose

hell we done gone past all that bawlmouth , come go with us  lol

I got a coondog that was shocked off so many deer if he runs across on in the woods he will come back to me with head down and tail tucked... he will be good to go in about 20-30 minutes after that, but I can't expect anything out of him when he's waiting for that shock

I started out hollering NO and then beating the tar out of him after he finished. Now I have a shock collar. Boone is hard headed and them cows are SOOOO tempting but we are getting there. That Jackass is especially tempting. Boone has been kicked in the head 4-5 times but still wants a piece of him. We are getting much better though. Shock collars can work miracles compared to just hollaring and whipping as far as this dog goes. It can reach a lot farther than my arm can.