EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

I dare each and every one of you to deny that the thought does not cross your mind...  ;) ;D

... so what "proves" that somebody has the "best" dog?  ... is it because he's got thousands of pictures with big, bad sombitches?  Is it because he's got a big, shiny belt buckle that says he won some tournament?(yes, I would like one too, but that is besides the point  ;D) ... is it because other people says he's got the best? ... is it because he can sell dogs for more money than anyone else?  ... I could go on...  ;D

... in my opinion(which don't count for much), the only way to fairly judge a dog is by hunting TOGETHER/BEHIND EACH OTHER'S DOGS on different properties MANY, MANY TIMES... for both parties to TRULY come to an understanding of things.  Only when in this environment can patterns be recognized, strengths appreciated, as well as weakness'...

... this is why I appreciate so much the opportunity to drop my dogs beside other "good" dogs... keeps everybody honest... especially myself  ;)

... this tournament crap sounds fun, until I start to think about all the ways I could "increase my odds of winning"...  ;D .... then all the fun seems to go right out the window..

i agree noah .

but think about this , who's got the prettiest woman ??

it all depends on who's judging . lol

Absolutely, lol  ;D   ... of course I am talking apples to apples... for instance, I hunted with CutterBay a while back and his dogs are INCREDIBLE trail dogs, just a completely different style than what I have, but really good dogs all the same!  Impossible to compare what he has to what I have... as each produce hogs in their own way.

What I am talking about in this post is more "specific" however...  ;D

I'm with u. The best dog is subjective. One guys dog may be great where he hunts but change the scenery and it may be another guys. I have hunted with several folks each one supposedly having the best dogs this or that guy has ever seen. Each time was on the same piece of property. Each group brought their own pluses along with their own faults. I believe in their own environment each one of these groups had good dogs but in that environment none were what I would call great dogs. Most were good but not exactly what that area required.

in my opinion, a great dog doesn't need to be compared to other dogs...because he performs with company or without...

I think it is like comparing ^%$'s I don't care what you have. I care about what I have and does it satisfy me? There is always something better in some way. I can say that I like my dogs and I don't care if anybody else does. I sure hope you like your dogs too. I am always willing to share a pup with anybody that will not put it up for sale. People helped me and I don't mind helping others. But I can say for sure that I have the best dogs I have ;D I like them.

I disagree... a great dog SHOULD be compared if one intends to improve what is... checking "oneself" is very important in a breeding operation.

That is true. As long as you look at it that way instead of a pissing contest.

 ... allow me to use myself as an example...  ;D

... for years, my "mentors" have always made the point to look honestly at what I have produced...  "COMPARED TO WHAT?"  It is indeed easy to fall into a groove of catching hogs consistently and "think" you have a good dog....

... the only way to "PROVE" this, however, is by hunting with other dogs to test your chit.

... does not get any more simple than that.

dub... even with very best friends... there is ALWAYS some level of a pissing contest.   Nothin' wrong with it in my opinion, as long as respect is shown

Very good topic
Now how do you compare apples to apples?   My hunting partner & I raise & share the same family of dogs.  These dogs are very similar, but when we go to getting real picky & start talking about the next breeding, each of us desire a little different style dog-- baying style... I'm sure most would not see any difference in most of these dogs, often others cannot tell them apart looking at them, but we can. So with these dogs being so similar they are still different.  So the one I think is the best may not be the best in his eyes.   The main thing we agree on is body style--confirmation, and color has nothing to do with this.

Yes... you and I are certainly on the same page... 

... this is indeed the hard part it seems... finding like minded(enough) individuals to compare "apples to apples"... however... much can still be learned when compared to HOG DOGS of different styles

I agree with this too...and what you said is probably the biggest problem when judging dogs...it is not the dogs but the folks looking at the dogs...you said your dogs are so much alike that others fail to see the difference but you and your hunting buddy see the differences...that's a big one right there...

When I hunt with someone who has a great dog I can see it right away...

sometimes great dog work is not seen or appreciated...so  how can these folks know/judge what a good dog is?

sometimes someone has a good pack and catches lots of hogs...and they think they have a great set of dogs until they loose the lead dog and the pack won't range out any more...and the hunter is having to put the dogs on top of the hogs to catch one...

not trying to be contradictory but throwing this out there so we can look at this from other angles...

I have seen others do this in the past... including myself...  :)

A little hound story to prove your point. The older guy that taught me to train horses and I've hunted with since I was a teenager (whi by the way is a gifted animal trainer) had a nice young walker hounder. Another guy about his age had a young blue dog. The guy with the blue dog started hunting him aline to get him "finished" (if they ever are) and so after some weeks they jouned up to hunt together again. The man was proud of how ole blue was doing so the first drop my mentor said cut ole blue. So blue is cast and strikes. After a little bit of blue grubbing what seem to be a rough track the walker dog (Sid) is turned to him. Sid slings gravel gets to the blue dog hits the track and runs it like he is tied to it treeing it a couple hundred yards ahead leaving ole blue in the dust.
Now, had Sid not been there the owner of ole blue would have been proud of how blue grubbed a tough track and finally treed it after 45 minutes to an hour under the assumption that it was an old cold rough track. If all you hunt with is yourself, then all you know us the standard your dogs set. But by going with others you xan honestly see what you have and if it really is a standard or in need of culling.

(This post is in no way meant to ridicule or disrespect blueticks)

Tough, Tough, Tough.........

I don't think ANY dog is the "best" dog. There are to many variables.....wait.....I have an idea.....lets see....win the lottery....quit your job and then go spend a month in Florida hunting...then Georgia, then go to Tennessee and hunt for a month...then Alabama, the Louisiana and Mississippi, then Oklahoma, then California then get your passport and go to Central America, Argentina then skip the pond to Australia then New Zealand then finish up in Europe. If you catch hogs with your dogs in every one of those places then...well...you have some dang good dogs...lol

Now all joking aside...Truth be told...if you catch hogs on a regular basis in your area and you can say there aren't any dogs in your area that outshine yours then you SHOULD be happy. If your lucky enough to be able to hunt another geographical location and find your dogs lacking...well... There's something to work on...just don't forget.....sometimes when you take something apart it don't always go back together the same way.

I'll settle this. Everyone send me your best dog and i'll hunt them one at a time (may take multiple hunts to decide) until summer and i'll crown the champ.   ;D ;D ;D ;D

At work when a great idea didn't work it got swept under the rug....and it never happened...lots of good points made...what I consider to be a great dog others might cull them...that is a fact...some like rough hot nosed short range dogs...I don't but if I was a hood dog hunter I probably would like that style...

To me....Each and every person that owns a dog has " THE BEST" dog,be it hunting,companion,working or whatever!!! There will never be a day on this earth that i dont have a dog by my side to keep my sanity!!!!

That's a good point there Rockin' Roo! My "best dog in the world" isn't even a hunting dog! LOL!  ;D
Good ol T-Rex. 18 years old and still kicking!
(http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd520/blakebh247/T-Rex1.jpg)

But I do get the point you're trying to make Noah. I was talking about this with Blake the other day. He said, "You know that we have good dogs right?". I said, "yeah, we have pretty good dogs, and we get on plenty of hogs. I wouldn't say we have the best, but we have some good dogs." Blake said, "well hell, there is all this talk about great dogs... but I'll take 10 good dogs any day to one great dog if what we have is good dogs." LMAO! I thought that was pretty funny but a good point. That stuck with me. If what you have is working and putting you in the pork, then it can't be too bad. You are always striving to be better Noah, and improve on your dogs and your hunting, but IMO, I think that occurs everytime you're in the woods. If you start with something good then the only way to improve and compaire is to hunt the chit out of em and see who and what makes the cut.

Great post Noah!  I think the best is a dog that can hunt pretty much any style weather its casting, winding, walking, or riding!  a dog that really just puts pork at the end of the stick time after time!  That is not hunting a pack of dogs either just a one dog show that will hold hogs for hours at a time!  Not too much grit but enough to keep them in one spot/ or the bottom to stay with one! ( ive hunted with the syle dogs also that kick up dust in your face and in 5min there .9 and others run out 500 and bay solid, you can keep that .9 dog  ;) )

I can say in the past 5 or 6 years ive really come to realize what i have thats for sure...  In my area the younger gen. has exploded and yes they all have strike dogs that will find hogs but not always finish them so....... that is why we now have the track stars in todays times which i'm sure it has become like this all over!  Todays time with one dog on the ground or 2 from diff. owners at most is where you really get to see a dog shine! 

 If a man has a dog that he likes, fits his hunting style and has nothing major about the dog he would change, then he has the best dog for himself. Thats what it's all about, as long as your happy, don't pay attention to what other people think.

I could be wrong but I think Noah is more concerned with how his dogs preform, than how many hogs he catches.   I have come to that point the past few years.  I would rather know my dogs did there jobs to the best of their ability in the situation I placed them in than catching a bunch of hogs each hunt.  Don't confuse me as saying I don't like to catch hogs still.  But it's more satisfaction with my dogs performance or the company of a good hunting partner, that can look deep at the big picture.

x2 on catching hogs...i knew I could catch or shoot quite a few hogs with 1 or 2 dogs but that is not as important to me...i like to see 5 or 6 dogs keep a big hog shut down and then catch it if told to do so or back up when told if I choose to shoot...hope 2 have the same type of dogs from these pups I have now...

Not ME! Lol

not me , but my buddy has the best dog and thats y mine look so good,lol

Well I reckon if a man says he's got the best dogs...I ain't gonna argue with
him cuz apparently he thinks pretty highly of them.  Sometimes people agree
with themselves because they know what works best for them.  I've hunted with lots of people that thought hog hunting was some kind of pissin contest
And there dogs couldn't be beat.  Then I've hunted with some guys that would share wisdom with one another and lend helping hand.them the kinds people you listen to when you hear about the best dogs.which is not often because theyout to have a good time catching swine...

I know one thing when u load up ur dogs and u know that u r going to catch a hog most of the time 3 or 4 where every u take them to  u have a good dog r dogs. To many people get caught up in the pissing contest their is nothing better to me then to watch a great dog work but in today's world of hog hunting people thank they have a great dog but actually have never even seen one work.

Well i think Obama is the worst president but it looks like there were more people who thought he was great. :-[

Good one  ;D

v
How can we have a argument if you post something we agree on?

I got the best dog, the fastest horse, the sharpest knife and the finest rifle. Hear my challenge echo
on this website to any man. I will fight to the death to be a free man, to hunt the hogs, trap the hogs, to drink from cool creeks and sleep under the stars. I have no road to follow. I make my own. I have no man to answer to except myself. I fear no creature on God's green earth for I AM A Hog Hunter!   

You need to step away from the pipe my friend.. :)

I am not talking about the best dog...but a great hog dog will hunt as well anywhere there are hogs...if he has the nose to wind and trail...and the inclination to do so...and has the brain power to know where to find a hog and the heart to stick with it to bring the hog to bay...and has the inclination to stop one and keep it stopped if the opurtunity is there to do so... and this dog makes tracking look easy...cuts and slashes to find the hot end of a track snd does not hesitate to swim a wide river to bay and catch that hog....this dog will look good anywhere alongside any dog...

Agreed!

or at least puff puff pass ;D ;D :o

I've had the privilege to hunt with many people over the years and see many good dogs.

One thing I've always strived for is to avoid the "whose dog is better" BS, and simply have challenged myself to raise and hunt dogs that suit me personally....after all I am the one paying for the feed.  What I breed, raise and hunt would not suit everyone and for that I am proud.  Another reason I think it is virtually impossible to ever produce a dog that everyone would be satisfied with....because everyone's expectations are a little different.  I have produced some very good dogs (in my own opinion) and it's those dogs for which I compare my own to and that I strive to reproduce.  I know the caliber of dogs the line is capable of producing and so my comparisons, expectations and criteria by which I cull is based on that.

Someone having a "good dog" just doesn't do anything for me personally.  All that says to me is perhaps that person got lucky and raised a freak, maybe they had more money than the next guy and bought what someone else couldn't, or even someone gave them something special.  What DOES impress me is someone who is breeding, raising and consistantly bringing their hard work to the woods.  Those are the people who you should pay attention to, and learn from.

A person can beat their chest and claim to have the best dog in the world one minute, then find themself searching the dog trade the next when he/she gets killed.

Bryant....I like

A good is in the eye of the beholder. My dogs are pretty good to me but if I hunt the 2000 acres behind my house the hogs will make them look like they have never bayed or caught a hog in there life. We have had several different people say they could stop the hogs and know they had good dogs but the hogs run so bad and the palmettos are so thick it is hard. So if the owner is happy with there dog than that's what matters

Very well said Bryant and i agree 100%!

ive had what i consider great dogs and lost them as well, never thought i would get one as good as the last but it seem to me the better personal conection u have with ur dogs and hunting partners the better the hunt is, u can go hunt by ur self with the best dog(s) in the world, but if theres no conection with the dogs its never much fun, but u can take a dog youve raised and traind and go catch the same pigs and have a good ol buddy with u and neather one of u will stop talking about the hunt, how the dogs worked, and how one of the 2 of u sliped r triped going to the bay, idk just  seem alot more fun to me with good friends and the dogs