EAST TEXAS HOG DOGGERS FORUM

last 2 hunts went like this...

Saturday night tuned my 4 dogs loose at 11:00 pm and they rolled out hard and struck a hog a good ways out in about 5 minutes and they crossed about 4 or more fields...finally called dogs off and no hog...

2 weeks before let dogs out at 9 pm and they struck within 5 minutes and at 2 am called 2 dogs out...was told not to go/trespass where they were bayed...this was about 3 miles from where we started...went home around 5 am and came back at 10 am and found them bayed at 11 am...was able to call dogs out because not allowed to enter property...but I sure wanted to walk in and shoot the hog...

So I now made up my mind to breed a mt cur gyp to a leggy pit bull that is as game as a good bull dog should be...The mt cur gyp has plenty of hunt, grit and range...probably lose some nose and hunting sense but hoping to get a few RCD gyps out of this cross...the long range dog days are about over with the smaller plots of land and the steeper fines for trespassing...don't want to lose the stick no matter what type of dogs...once they strike a hog...just want the race to be shorter because of a hog stopping dog and not a bay busting dog that keeps the hog running through the thick brush......

I don't care for the lose baying dogs...so not going that route...

There you go Rueben.  I have always had dogs that knew what they could catch and if not they would put teeth on it to try and hold it there till we got there .   Ruff Ruff Ruff.  We caught tons of big hogs with not much running problems, sure had to sew dogs up here and there but when I got smart and started putting really good vest on them the big cuts almost stopped .  I had a gold mine in those old dogs Cj , War Dog, Daisy, Steven, Mojo, Camo , Sis , Old Blu , Black Jack and a ton more. Great damn dogs.  Then I got the silly notion of listening to everybody say man your dogs are just to damn ruff and you need to cut some ruff out of them well guess what I did and I chased big bad boars for a long while.  No more !  Big big big mistake messing with those ruff dogs.  Now am headed back to the way it was and that is why I bred this Fla dog to all my bitches .  I have noticed with my dogs if I want some really stop power just throw him in the bunch and that's all it takes all the others will pile in soon as he grabs results caught hog !  If I don't want such ruff dogs take him and old Blu out the pack and here is your med ruff type of dogs .  Throw them back in when you want and your back at it .

I agree with you Rueben 100%

A buddy that has had hog dogs for over 30 years called me the other day .  He is after a boar hog that he says is over 400 lbs ,  I  myself have only caught one that was 419 years and years ago and guess with who with him.  This man knows what a 400 lb and over hog looks like and He has been on this hog twice both times whipped his dogs asses threw them and was gone, he's bad real bad .  He knows were this hog lives .  He ask me to come over with my dogs and he will put his with mine and we are going to try and catch this big old bad boy.  The only way you gonna catch a hog like that is either run him to death for hours and hours and miles at a time are put some real heat on him and by that I mean dogs that stick like glue when the fight starts, not no bay busting wanna be's but dogs they will be there when the chit gets deep  .  That cross you talking about should give you just that with those Mt Curs. I like it myself ! 

Ruben, have you tried just one or two dogs at the same spot?

You have right idea and unfortunately the right motif. Long range dogs are becoming less and less desirable simply due to lack of land and the faulty image a lot of people view as "hog doggers". I come across the true long range half a mile out the box dog once every few years, other then that long range in most people's minds is a rangy enough stay out of sight that will go a mile running a hog. It is what it is. Back to your point, you are headed in a direction that hopefully is the answer. Since your breeding a rough dog to a pit you should get quite a few rcds. I have bought a couple litter of half cur half pit. a lot turned into rcds but a couple did turn into nothing more the super gritty, get mouthful just because the hog isnt running baybuster type you described. Only reason I'm still not using them....not sure. Last one got killed and my buddy had a bulldog I knew was solid, and here I am. Would like to see some pics of dam and sire, good luck!

These hogs sure will make you question your dogs and strategy.
I went the opposite way, switched to looser style. It's tough either way. Good luck..

Hey Reuben that sounds like a real good cross, I would also like to see pics of the parents if you have any or have the time. Either way good luck with'em, im sure you will get some good dogs out of it.

Well I guess I am stuck in my ways with alot of this so my bias will be obvious.  Haha.

We have also encountered the land issues and running hogs all night...but cannot stomach a hunting dog I am staring at all night. We have attempted to tailor a mixture of yellers to accommodate a broader range of scenarios. Running the long range dogs in the lead with a backup up short ranged Yeller missiles that can be pointed and fired from the wheelers.

Have just got to the point that we steer away from the smaller tracts with no accessible border property.  Just not worth the headache anymore.

Also we strictly hunt nocturnal which cuts alot of the BS that comes with daylight hunting.

Rough or not.  If I am having to basically find the hogs by walking them over the sign...........they stay in the woods.  >:D

You either gotta catch'em where u find them or run them till they stop. That's my motto. Not saying I can do either but that's my guiding principle.

  heck Rueben I may have just what you need on the ground already   lol  back when mom's hip went out I told folks about my negligent breeding that took place between my  mnt. cur and my cat gyp [ which are just spotted bulldogs ]  lol  i'm thinking they will carry on the tradition of my original dogs in the  ''0 ''  bay dept. that little mnt. cur is one gamey lil sum buck .  of course I have broken him from even looking at a pig  . lol   but yes sir   short country dogs are gonna be the ticket for the future .

I agree with that statement 100% Mr. Whitten

I Agree as well a good mix of dogs has worked for me

Yup

Reuben, I hope you get exactly what your looking for out of this future cross.
I haven't had hardly any luck with any half pit half curs I've seen, but, Ill say that's because I was looking at them thru cur dog glasses. If you know exactly what you should be looking for it shouldnt take you long to get there.


The halvsies I've been around we're dumb, hard headed, no hunt and usually dead at 18-20 months old. They sometimes had a real nice look to them, but I couldn't get passed the fact that I don't like tripping on em.
I bet if you had a litter of 10 and made them good ol south Brazoria county style road hunting dogs you could cull down thru them and have 2 that come out suitable at 2 years, from there, with the right descisions, you may be on to something.

I agree Buddy .  Stop'em were they are at are go to the next option which is running them till their legs fall off .  The way I see it is you got to get good at one are the other.  Anything inbetween and most the time you will go home skunked are with some little hogs and the big boy gets away again .

I had a old timer tell me something that if you have a dog that just bays his a$$ of and is real loud baying and want to put his teeth own whatever he is baying will most like break and run but a dog that kinda quiet but just bays constantly and keeps whatever he is baying calm will stay ther until you can get there we bayed a boar hog the other night that was suppose to be a runner but where we struck him at and where he got caught at he never moved he had no ears and a bob tail know he has no ears a bob tail and no nuts

I believe some dogs honestly just know how to bay a hog.  I may be wrong and it'd be hard to prove, but some dogs just seem to know what to do to make a boar hog stand there and be bayed, where as another dog will make him break.

I'm not talking about bay busting dogs or nut grabbing dogs or starting an argument, I'm just talking about dogs that have a finesse to em. Might be talking crazy!

  I don'tknow what I did to do that last reply but I agree with Ben.That,s why I say, good dogs bred to work stock work best. They handle stock with finess first and brute force when finess dosen't work. They come here knowing where to be and what to do in relation to the task at hand. I have  hunted every style of dog from one end of the spectrum to the other and the stock bred dogs have produced more caught hogs. They are getting extremly hard to find.

;)

I have made the same conclusion...as most of you know I like the right mt cur...I believe that these dogs are hard to beat for locating and sticking with the track...and they will catch a hog but have a hard time setting up to catch because of the thick vegetation...they are bad about fighting the hog and I believe that their mindset is to try and kill the hog and as a result the hog keeps breaking bay....some pen training will sometimes help in teaching the dog to stop the hog from what I have seen...

As most of you have guessed by now I am not a fan of the average stock dog as a hunting dog but I see that some have the mindset to stop a hog as they would a cow or bull and bring them back to the herd and don't get me wrong...there are some good hunting dogs in the stock dogs but I will pass...but that natural ability to stop the livestock and turn it back to the herd comes from selection of these traits in stock dogs from cow dog men who breed for stock dogs...I have seen a few cow dogs that were culls as cow dogs and hog dogs because of too much gritt and I owned one...he was the perfect fit to run with my mt cur cause he sure could put the brakes on a runner and the mt cur wasn't bad himself but he had the ability to locate and stick with the track...the other dog was a cull but was one of the best I have seen to stop a hog and he was a good hunting dog as well...he wasn't my dog but when I think about good hog dogs he is up close to the top of my list...

So I believe in that inclination and mindset to stop a runner from certain dogs...

Bryant...I have had success with running one and sometimes 2 dogs in the past...just baying loose and not attempting to catch unless the hog or hogs break...gritty dogs usually only bay one hog cause they break bays and single one out...

T-bob...I have seen some good ones that were 1/2 pit 1/2 mt cur out of my dogs...about half stick close until the dogs strike and then they fall in the race...the other 1/2 make excellent striking catch dogs and most of these hunt out far and will not bark just catch...I never wanted to bring that in to my old line because it was tight bred of nothing but top strike dogs with lots of hunt and range...but it always kept crossing my mind to do it for myself and now I am making that jump...the dogs I hunt right now 3 out of the 4 need vests but the grit is not quite where it needs to be...the plan is 1/2 and 1/2 at first and then 1/4 pit and then try and maintain that...

Rednose...might try to post a picture of the dog...he is a 65 pound leggy dog that is a solid catch dog if the hog breaks will go and hunt for about 30 minutes before checking in...he is a 3rd generation catch dog is about all I know and has a touch of game bred APBT...

The gyp is the same as my old line and he grandfather is out of my yard and about a catch dog he was besides being a great strike dog...that dog was inbred from a dog named buck who was his grand father on both sides and great grandfather as well...

I have her in my yard as well as her full brother...A friend was kind enough to give me the 2 dogs because they hunted too hard too far and are bay busters...

I think the biggest problem will be that they might be caught too far away and that can become a problem but that is a choice I have made knowing that...talking about the 1/2 pits...

but I am will to go this route because the tracts are getting smaller and the fines steeper...

Halfbreed...thanks but the gyp should be ready to take a male any day now so I am moving forward with the plan...

Reuben. I know your obviously a staunch Mt Cur man but you should consider a bird/bull cross. Most hunt all around you. They will run a track but tend to wind hogs. They have an excellent nose. Better nose than most curs. A lot of them are VERY rough. A good dog for "smaller" track of land. A good EP crossed over a leggy pit is hard to beat for what your wanting.

I guess I myself just see things a little different .  I like dogs that hunt good noses , fast , quick and all the good stuff but am not out myself to herd hogs am out to stop and catch them and the shorter race I can have is usally a big plus .  Sure I like smart dogs and sure there is some great cattle dogs that also make great hog dogs a ton of them but which ones don't really work as cattle dogs the biggest complaint that I hear is the ones with to much grit to catchy to ruff on cattle am sure there are other reasons but this is what I hear the most of and a lot are given away and end up great hog dogs.   They are smart they got some great noses they come from great gene pools .  To me its not about the herding n a dog am not out to herd anything of course I know everybody is different but this is just me  .  I would like to have a remote controlled dog also but that aint happening.  Also in all my time of hog hunting when you do end up baying a whole herd of hogs what do you end up catching out of it one two hogs and the rest are gone with dogs going in every different direction and sometimes for miles if you got long range big bottom dogs. Atleast from what I read and see on this forum I don't see people that are baying up these sounders are whole herds of hogs coming out with 10 12 hogs so the hogs went somewere after the catch .  Also  Don't get me wrong I like dogs with bottom but I also like dogs with the salt if you gonna put your mouth on one you better have the balls to catch it unless you are grabbing the back side to make it sit down .   Am not calling anybody wrong its just that the land these days atleast were I hunt is getting shorter and shorter and some is broke up in many different owners and if you don't get them put down pretty fast you are gonna end up doing just what Rueben did having to wait and wait make phone calls and then have to call the dogs out if you can do that it can be hours and hours for that to happen.  I myself I hate it when my dog are dogs are off on land I don't even know who owns it and we are sitting there just hoping and praying none get shot are the land owner don't show up with a gun and game warden right behind him .  I watch these Aussie boys and their dogs now them boys got it down.  Just because a dog is ruff gritty catchy fast and got all the tools to put one down don't mean he cant have a great nose and be a great find dog himself .  I get the feeling over time that a lot of people think of ruff dogs with some salt as being far less supierior to looser baying types of dogs and just because they are not cattle bred dogs to the hilt then they cant be right for hog hunting  .  This could not be futher for the truth of the matter.  That's just me again man maybe am wrong but if you didn't have many dogs with some real salt there would be a hell of a lot less hogs caught and put on this board.  I admire the cattle dogs but I also admire a bone a fide salty hog dog also !

I remember my stomach turning knots every time I turned my old pack of dogs out back then because of the range and don't quit a track kind of dogs that will range out until finding a hog...the worries...gritty long range dogs can get killed by a hog or run over on the road, shot or stolen...but I basically want the same type of dog but with the gritt to catch it at the first opportunity...shorter races mean I get to go home earlier, not trespass as often to get my dogs back, catch a hog more often...just have to vest the dogs up which I already started doing...besides, at this age I don't need to be trekking for miles to get to my dogs...and another thing...it is better to know that the hog will not break bay once I start walking in to them if I know it is caught...right now with the dogs I have I can walk in and right before I get there the hog breaks... happens more often than not...but I don't want to carry a full time catch dog but have in the past  ;D

I always said I liked January to April hog dogging because it is cooler and the weeds are down and we catch more hogs...my theory on that besides dogs not over heating has to do with the gritty dogs maneuvering better and running faster without obstructions to deal with and this makes it to where they catch hogs easier...but the palmettos are evergreen...always a but in there somewhere...  :) but that is hog hunting...

And people say us Fla boys aint smart   ;) ;D

here is the pic of the male...bred on July 28, 2013...

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below is pic of the mt cur gyp

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hope to get a few RCD's that strike and catch hogs...I like red and don't care for the chrome on him but his sire, grandsire were big red catch dogs and the grand dam the same...but his dam had a little chrome on her...

he is a border line cull because if the hog breaks he will hunt for an hour before checking in, not a good trait for ac lead in catch dog...I think it is a good trait to pass on to what I need...he probably weighs about 70 pounds maybe more...