Shut em down!

[BIG BEN]

What Michael is referrring to, and his question remains...there is a difference between a so-called rough dog and a catch dog.  If you want dogs that straight catch, why even mess with curs?  Why not run a pack of bulldogs?  What he's referring to is a dog that will stop a hog, then back up and bay it.  Happens VERY little even though everyone says "so and so got him stopped and we finally caught him".  If this was the case, there would be a heck of a lot of hogs caught (with bulldogs...not with curs hanging all over it when you get there) in the open, which doesn't often happen.  If it's the dog truly doing the STOPPING (not CATCHING), seems hogs wouldn't often end up bayed in places beneficial to themselves (wash-outs, edges of water, against fallen trees) like they mostly do.

Another question for those with the rough (catch) dogs.  How often do you bay up groups of hogs together?  Ever thought that one hog you find the curs caught on when you got there could have been the smallest of ten that were together when the curs decided to catch out and send the rest packing?  I think the latter is what happens more than anyone would admit.  A catching cur dog would be a quick cull on most of the old time stock mens yards.

I hunted with an old friend a few weeks ago who I used to hunt with some when I bayed and shot hogs (which he still does) and was reminded how a true stock bred dog should work a sounder of hogs.  His dogs bayed a group of seven hogs and had them bunched pretty as could be when we got there.  He shot a hog, and instead of the dogs all pouncing on the wounded, they immediately got ahead and stopped the group.  We eased in about 50 yards later and he shot another hog.  People can call BS on this all they want, but in the end all seven original hogs lay dead....one shot at a time.  Probably one of those things I'll see once in a lifetime, but thats the true definition in my mind of how a true stock bred dog should work.

Ive seen this happen more than one time with Bigo's Bear dog. This is the kind of dogs I want on my yard. Id much rather relace or repair a bulldog rather than my bay dogs anyday.

[waylon-N.E. OK]

scdogman wrote>
I am going to leave this post alone, but Waylon what u define as rough I call a dog that needs to be culled.      
 
  
We agree 100% on that fact. But I do see that type of dog sometimes bragged about, some one will say " he's catchy, or rough or gritty " to me he is trouble. if I am the man that took him to the woods, you can bet he won't make the ride home in my dog box

[ETHHunters]

[quote   If it's the dog truly doing the STOPPING (not CATCHING), seems hogs wouldn't often end up bayed in places beneficial to themselves (wash-outs, edges of water, against fallen trees) like they mostly do.
[/quote]This is one of the best statements I have seen made on ETHD!!

[chainrated]

I know dogs can stop hogs but I have seen some bad boar hogs that have not been stopped and caught yet and I have had the dead and cut up dogs to prove it there is one place around here we dont even go on because of this and anytime we get close to it try to back off of it !  There was a boar hog that got shot out there by th eland owner that dressed over 400 lbs and we have seen some of his skull that are just unbelievable and a couple other buddys will tell you the same!

That's where I would be going the most..  

[ETHHunters]

I know dogs can stop hogs but I have seen some bad boar hogs that have not been stopped and caught yet and I have had the dead and cut up dogs to prove it there is one place around here we dont even go on because of this and anytime we get close to it try to back off of it !  There was a boar hog that got shot out there by th eland owner that dressed over 400 lbs and we have seen some of his skull that are just unbelievable and a couple other buddys will tell you the same!

That's where I would be going the most.. 

x2

[Txhoghunter]

I know dogs can stop hogs but I have seen some bad boar hogs that have not been stopped and caught yet and I have had the dead and cut up dogs to prove it there is one place around here we dont even go on because of this and anytime we get close to it try to back off of it !  There was a boar hog that got shot out there by th eland owner that dressed over 400 lbs and we have seen some of his skull that are just unbelievable and a couple other buddys will tell you the same!

That's where I would be going the most.. 

x2

x3...quality over quantity any day...

[djhogdogger]

  I guess some people don't have my sense of humor! LOL

[leonriverboy]

I fear no hog.  The bigger and meaner the better.  I like true lock down running catch dogs.  I hate bay busting dogs and have culled more for that reason than anything else.  If they can't catch and hold a 300 lb  boar they have no business trying.

[TexasHogDogs]

Well that's the problem!  You see I hunt this property that joins that place and the man that owns the place does not want anybody hunting his place but I know him and he has give me permission to go and get my dogs if they get over there but the catch is I have to call him and get a Holt of him first.

Well as we all know this can take some time if he don't answer the phone and I have to track him down and by that time my dogs have been over there a while and on those hogs over there if you ain't right on top of your dogs then you are in for a bad bad bad day !

I agree with yall that is the first place I would love to hunt if I could get permission to hunt it and be able to hunt it right and take my dogs in there and do what I needed to do then those bad boys might be in some kinda trouble but the way it is the odds are stacked against me and my dogs .  I have counted as many as I think it was 12 - 15 boar hogs running in a group over there  and we ain't talkin no small hogs we talkin all hogs over 200 lbs and a lot bigger.  Every time I have been on that place I have had dogs cut up are killed every damn time .   One day my Black Jack dog and some more bayed over in that place we finally got a Holt of the guy to go to them when we got there they were bayed in the thickest crap I have ever seen and we had to fight to get our way in .  Once we got in there the hogs had the briar's wallowed out  like a bear den in there and as we got in there  I had to get my eyes adjusted because it was almost dark in  there but sunshine on the outside once I got my eyes adjusted I could not believe what I was seeing and my buddy Kyle either.  There were about 20 -25 hogs all bayed up in that clearing they had in there and they were all standing butt to butt while the dogs were keeping them bayed  it sounded like two freight trains it was so loud and every damn hog in there i swear looked like they were over 200 lbs and some way way bigger.  Turn the catch dog loose he caught one and I shot one and hogs went every were it was a unbelievable site to say the least .

Another time I had to go on that place after a big boar hog as we were walking to the back of the place were they dogs were bayed big big big ass boar hogs were about to run us over just un real man my buddy Cory was about to have a fit to say the least hahahahahahha!  We seen one black and white boar hog in there that has to be the biggest wild hog I have ever seen in my life he look like a Volkswagon Beatle and was a painted black and white hog .  Beleive me we have seen some chit in that place.

If he would give me permission it would be on like donkey kong that place is the key to that whole dang creek bottom from end to end were the hogs call home and the next place over you sure better not get caught in that place they have done told us you get caught in here hunting and its on big time and they told us straight to our faces we love the wild hogs and we feed them we want them here.  Would'nt you know some city slickers from Houston owns that place , those two places hold the hogs like I said for that whole creek for miles around !


Sorry so long no other way to tell the story.

[Ladogos]

i wouldnt have a dog that will run a hog for hours i can catch 3 before you get that one stoped  and if you dont think so get your pocket book out ill show you

there is one place around here we dont even go on because of this and anytime we get close to it try to back off of it !  There was a boar hog that got shot out there by th eland owner that dressed over 400 lbs and we have seen some of his skull that are just unbelievable and a couple other buddys will tell you the same!

This is the place I would be going the most.

X 4   isnt this the reason we go hunting is to catch "THE BIG ONE "   

[kds]

All I got to say is if u go huntin on that place that texashogdogs is talkin bout u better take somebody with u to put ur dogs back together bc u are in for very very bad news on that place. It really doesnt matter if u have loose bayin dogs or rough dogs u are goin to get ur dogs in a wreck on that place. It doesnt matter where u hunt at bc the hogs are goin to try to run right to that place where u have to call that guy.

[Wmwendler]

What Michael is referrring to, and his question remains...there is a difference between a so-called rough dog and a catch dog.  If you want dogs that straight catch, why even mess with curs?  Why not run a pack of bulldogs?  What he's referring to is a dog that will stop a hog, then back up and bay it.  Happens VERY little even though everyone says "so and so got him stopped and we finally caught him".  If this was the case, there would be a heck of a lot of hogs caught (with bulldogs...not with curs hanging all over it when you get there) in the open, which doesn't often happen.  If it's the dog truly doing the STOPPING (not CATCHING), seems hogs wouldn't often end up bayed in places beneficial to themselves (wash-outs, edges of water, against fallen trees) like they mostly do.

Another question for those with the rough (catch) dogs.  How often do you bay up groups of hogs together?  Ever thought that one hog you find the curs caught on when you got there could have been the smallest of ten that were together when the curs decided to catch out and send the rest packing?  I think the latter is what happens more than anyone would admit.  A catching cur dog would be a quick cull on most of the old time stock mens yards.

I hunted with an old friend a few weeks ago who I used to hunt with some when I bayed and shot hogs (which he still does) and was reminded how a true stock bred dog should work a sounder of hogs.  His dogs bayed a group of seven hogs and had them bunched pretty as could be when we got there.  He shot a hog, and instead of the dogs all pouncing on the wounded, they immediately got ahead and stopped the group.  We eased in about 50 yards later and he shot another hog.  People can call BS on this all they want, but in the end all seven original hogs lay dead....one shot at a time.  Probably one of those things I'll see once in a lifetime, but thats the true definition in my mind of how a true stock bred dog should work.

I CALL BS ON THAT STORY.............lol.......there must have been an 8th hog that did'nt make the personal desicion to bay up like the other 7 did. .  No in all seriousness Bryant.......I have seen the same thing and to me there is no better sucess on a hunt than to bay up a group like than and shoot several out of it at several different bays.  Most dogs do good to consistantly bay groups and even with the really great dogs; to re-bay the same group one or two more times after shooting out of it is top notch in my book.  The stars must have really lined up just right with some really good dogs to take that whole group in sucession.  I know it can hapen and I beleive you that it did.  But like you said most probly don't believe it, and more than likely its simply because they never hunted with the style of hunting and the kind of dogs it takes to have something like that happen.

RE to what Bryant said in reference to the original question....... (if it were truely the dogs stopping the hogs then more hogs would get bayed in the open as opposed to where they bay more often than not; like water edges, down trees, and creek banks.) There is allot of truth to what you are saying, but what causes a hog to choose the spot where he bays up.  Seems to me its more of a defensive chioce because there is almost always some sort of natural fortification.  But what put him on the defensive?  Seems to me like it has to be some influence from the dogs wether it be simply the influence of a loose baying dog barking or a "rough" dog getting hard and putting teeth on a hog.  I say putting teeth not because its a cliche term that sounds cool but because thats litterally what happens sometimes.   I hate to keep beating the same drum that I always do, but it seems to me the best way to describe it.  Take a group of cows; bunched, settled, dogs baying, and being driven horse back to the pens.  Now almost inevitably there is going to be a snakey cow that tries to head for the nearest thicket once you get close to the pens because she doesn't want to go to the house.  But its no big deal because the cow dogs will do thier job and transform from the simple loose baying barking presence that they are when the cows act right, into the bunch of in your face, ear eating, monsters that come out when a cow tries to run off from the bunch.  Ofcourse, the cow allmost always realizes the bunch is a good place to be and goes back.  Yeah, she may have been the one who decided to go back.  But there was a very strong influence of the dogs and had there been no dogs the cow would still be heading toward that thicket with cowboys in tow burning out thier horses for a cow that they will probly have to go back for later and rope anyway.  Now take some stock bred cur dogs that could be used on cows and hogs and its not easy to translate that cenario.  The cow becomes a hog and the security of the group becomes the security of a down tree or washout or god forbid a group of hogs.  The hog may have chosen to stop on his own but the right kind of rought dogs can influence that decion to stop sooner or closer than it otherwise would have.

Waylon