how you cull

[Mike]

Some of y'all cull waaay too early!

Unless there's a physical or mental issue, there's no way of judging how a pup under a year old will turn out. Those six month old firecrackers are usually disappointments by the time they're two or three years old.

I judge pups between age one and two... usually don't start them in the woods until a year old. Sometimes earlier depending on their maturity levels. They should steadily progress from there and get better with age.

[Cutter Bay Kennels]

Some of y'all cull waaay too early!

Unless there's a physical or mental issue, there's no way of judging how a pup under a year old will turn out. Those six month old firecrackers are usually disappointments by the time they're two or three years old.

I judge pups between age one and two... usually don't start them in the woods until a year old. Sometimes earlier depending on their maturity levels. They should steadily progress from there and get better with age.

Different lines if dogs mature at different rates. If I've got 10 pups in a litter, I'm not waiting until they are 20 months old to pick my 1 or 2 to keep for myself. I can't afford to feed that # of dogs, much less spend individual time with that many. At 12 weeks, I can make very good assumptions as to what out of that litter will suite me best. Have a goal, and do everything within your means  to stick to it. 

[waylon-N.E. OK]

i like the idea of waiting between 18 months and 24 months, my Abel dog was the quite lesser of the 2 between him and his brother Adam until about 18 months then he far surpassed Adam. I'm glad i waited. Now if a pup was cowardly or something that won't show any sign at all i may earlier

[Mike]

CBK, what can you tell at 12 weeks old?

Place the rest with your hunting partners... judge them when they hit the woods. I want to know what I have and what percentage makes a dog.

[waylon-N.E. OK]

" what can you tell at 12 weeks old? "

Lots of things Mike, like which one is cutest , which one poops the most. which one eats the most ect. ect.

Just kidding, i just wanted to tease cutter a little, I haven't done it all week 

[Cutter Bay Kennels]

CBK, what can you tell at 12 weeks old?

Place the rest with your hunting partners... judge them when they hit the woods. I want to know what I have and what percentage makes a dog.

Mike,

You'd be surprised what information you can gather by 12 weeks. As for the placement of pups, I agree, and do. If they leave my yard, I regularly request updates. I guess the question I have for you is :

What is a successfully litter?

Let's use 10 pups in a litter as our example. Is only 1 pup that turns out to be even interested in hunting, yet better than any dog it is hunted with worthy of the " successful litter" tag?  Would it take 7 out of the 10 to make above average dogs? 

[Reuben]

Mike,

I will say that it depends on the breed or strain. I do know there are breeds out there that are slow starters but I will have to see something in a pup for me to keep him. I do not mind if the pup starts hunting at ten months old and progresses from there. But if I do not see it improving it is gone by one year of age.

I had a pup that showed me more than any other pup I ever raised and he would make a round and if he came back you could bet your bottom dollar the other dogs were not going to find a hog. I am talking about when he was 5 or 6  years old. If he didn't come back get ready because he will be bayed.

If he came back the other dogs would be hunting but when he left out again he would still bay ahead of the other dogs. He just made it look easy. Yeller was my smartest dog but I have had some early starters that were excellent strike dogs and hard hunting dogs all of their lives.

I expect an early starter to always be a good hunting dog, if not it should be culled as soon as a replacement is available.

I believe that the larger the breed the slower they mature as a rule, therefore, they are slower to start. My personal opinions.

[Cutter Bay Kennels]

If you breed dogs long enough, you will have culls. Having the ability to spot markers early on is the key. You've got to know what your dealing with if you plan on looking in the first place.

The above statement is general, and not directed at anyone specifically.

[Reuben]

CBK, what can you tell at 12 weeks old?

Place the rest with your hunting partners... judge them when they hit the woods. I want to know what I have and what percentage makes a dog.

Mike,

You'd be surprised what information you can gather by 12 weeks. As for the placement of pups, I agree, and do. If they leave my yard, I regularly request updates. I guess the question I have for you is :

What is a successfully litter?

Let's use 10 pups in a litter as our example. Is only 1 pup that turns out to be even interested in hunting, yet better than any dog it is hunted with worthy of the " successful litter" tag?  Would it take 7 out of the 10 to make above average dogs? 

cutter bay,

I agree with what you are saying...

I like critiquing all the pups in a litter. And I will say that the pups that wind and go find will do the same when they become grown dogs. They will just wind longer range and make bigger circles. At least that was what I saw with that line of dogs I had for almost 20 years.

[Mike]

I'd call it a successful litter if half turn out to be above average dogs.

Pups change so much during that first year, what they do at 12 weeks old, they may be completely opposite at 6 months old or a year old.

That's why I say raise, or place, the entire litter so they can be evaluated.

It's only time,patience and feed.

[UNDERDOG]

CBK, what can you tell at 12 weeks old?

Place the rest with your hunting partners... judge them when they hit the woods. I want to know what I have and what percentage makes a dog.

Mike,

You'd be surprised what information you can gather by 12 weeks. As for the placement of pups, I agree, and do. If they leave my yard, I regularly request updates. I guess the question I have for you is :

What is a successfully litter?

Let's use 10 pups in a litter as our example. Is only 1 pup that turns out to be even interested in hunting, yet better than any dog it is hunted with worthy of the " successful litter" tag?  Would it take 7 out of the 10 to make above average dogs?

 

Cutter, give some details as to what you look for and how you select a pup at 12 weeks.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

[Reuben]

Bryant,

I know you asked Cutter Bay the question but I will also answer as to how I do it and like Mike says it is best to keep the whole litter or place the pups in the right hands with the agreement to breed to the ones that turn out. Placing pups is another thread... Some folks just don't appreciate a good dog or have a clue like most do on this site.

When I talk about the ages it is ball park but somewhat close. Some breeds probably can't test until way older due to their rate of maturity...

8-10 week old pups...I use hunger to my advantage and the pups are in a 10x10 kennel inside  my back yard. the backyard is 2  lots and is fenced in. I use beef liver to test and I make sure the pups are very hungry and hungry is key. The liver is chopped in small pieces and the pups all will be standing at the kennel wanting to be petted when I come up. this is conditioning that I expose the pups to when younger. I walk up to the fence and pet the pups a bit and then I give them a taste of raw liver. I whoop and holler and just excite the pups as I feed them their own tidbit and then I let them out. Again whooping and hollerin is conditioning to excite the pups later when giving commands to go get em or get ahead. Training starts early...After a couple of days of these tasty snacks (never feed much), the pups will go crazy when I walk toward their kennel. I always position myself from the upwind side so that the pups can wind/smell what I have for them. Again I am conditioning the pups to wind without actually training.

I walk up to the pen and show them the liver and put it almost to their noses. I then walk  out to the yard and position the liver pieces throughout the yard and always where they can circle and wind.

Before I open the gate I am taking mental notes as to who is winding and wanting out etc. etc. I open the gate and let the pups out. I whoop and holler encouragement...The first time I usually have to lead the majority of the pups out and I might have to range and circle some... I let them out about 2 or 3 times a week for this exercise and do this for 2 or 3 weeks give or take.

I train very little but condition and expose the pups to situations...I usually take the path of least resistance... it just sounds better than saying I do it the lazy mans way. also the pups have a short attention span so I take that into consideration.

My mental notes during this exercise;

to identify who finds more liver consistantly

who makes the bigger circles

who uses their nose for winding

who stays focused

The next step in evaluating is trailing ability...

Not saying what I do is selecting the best pup by 1 or 2 years of age by doing it this way but it sure makes me feel better when selecting. and I am not going to say how often it has worked.

I have seen pups that I didn't like turn on and were excellent hunting dogs by 1 year or so...

I reckon I do this more for recreation...because it is the most fun part.

These excercise might work good for me because I use hunting/trailing type dogs so this is kind of second nature for them. I don't think I could accomplish these tests using great dane pups..

[Cutter Bay Kennels]

Cutter, give some details as to what you look for and how you select a pup at 12 weeks.

Bryant,

You've been raising dogs for a good # of years according to your own comments.  If, after this time, you are not able to select pups out of a litter at 12 weeks old, than I certainly won't be able to explain it to you.  You either have the ability or you don't.  Something tells me you were merely trying to call me out.     I'm not biting.  You guys raise 10 pups to 2 years to get your 1 or 2 that you intend to carry on your kennel.  I'll continue to handle my selection process as I have, as it is working for me.  That's really all that matters to me anyhow.   

I simply was pointing out that there are different ways to do things, and one is not the be all end all.   

 

[chainrated]

I don't make any decisions on a pup until they are at least 8 months old, like Mike said they change so much that you can't possibly know what they will end up doing at a year and a half old.
I just don't think a pup being hungry at 10-12 weeks old and lookin for food has much to do with whether or not it will make a hogdog. There are plenty of strays runnin around that hunt for food every day but I don't know of many people that are catching hogs with them, I think we all wish it was that easy though..
The only way, in my opinion, to know for sure that you're keeping the best dogs out of a litter is to raise the whole litter and hunt them.. I know a lot of people don't want to do that , including myself... I try to keep as many as I can and get the rest to the people I hunt with and know well..
Trying to pick the best pup out of a litter at 10-12 weeks old is about like trying to catch hogs with a bluetick, it just ain't gonna happen very often 

[Reuben]

I don't make any decisions on a pup until they are at least 8 months old, like Mike said they change so much that you can't possibly know what they will end up doing at a year and a half old.
I just don't think a pup being hungry at 10-12 weeks old and lookin for food has much to do with whether or not it will make a hogdog. There are plenty of strays runnin around that hunt for food every day but I don't know of many people that are catching hogs with them, I think we all wish it was that easy though..
The only way, in my opinion, to know for sure that you're keeping the best dogs out of a litter is to raise the whole litter and hunt them.. I know a lot of people don't want to do that , including myself... I try to keep as many as I can and get the rest to the people I hunt with and know well..
Trying to pick the best pup out of a litter at 10-12 weeks old is about like trying to catch hogs with a bluetick, it just ain't gonna happen very often 

Chainrated,

I'll give you one example of hungry pups...Feed the pups and then turn them out. Let them run and play for 30 minutes and then call them to the kennel because it is time to put them up. How many pups do you think will come to kennel up when called??? My bet is none. Not only that but they learn to not heed a command when given. Then you have to run them down to catch them and now you have pups that know they can outrun you...

Now, do not feed the pups and turn the pups out when they are hungry. Let them play until they are tired. Fresh frisky pups want to run so I let them tire which makes it easy to kennel them, especially if you have food for them.

Once pups are tired I bring out the feed and call them to kennel and they come racing in to the kennel. I am teacing them to come with a voice command and sometimes voice command with hand signals and they are taught to kennel.

This is not in the books...sometimes we just learn to think outside the box
Like my Grand father once told me...we just need to be smarter than the dog.

[Hogdogginsuperchic]

Always need a female to keep us straight! Lol

Don't forget it!  

To each their own. It has definately been interesting to read everyone's opinions. Everything can be taken and applied in various situations, they are never the same time after time.

[UNDERDOG]

Cutter, give some details as to what you look for and how you select a pup at 12 weeks.

Bryant,

You've been raising dogs for a good # of years according to your own comments.  If, after this time, you are not able to select pups out of a litter at 12 weeks old, than I certainly won't be able to explain it to you.  You either have the ability or you don't.  Something tells me you were merely trying to call me out.    I'm not biting.  You guys raise 10 pups to 2 years to get your 1 or 2 that you intend to carry on your kennel.  I'll continue to handle my selection process as I have, as it is working for me.  That's really all that matters to me anyhow.    

I simply was pointing out that there are different ways to do things, and one is not the be all end all.  

  

No......cutter, I was not calling you out at all ,sincerly curious. I have my ideas and way but they are pretty simplistic and was relly interested in details as to what
hat and how you did it....


and if how you do it your way only matters to you why did you jump in the thread if you don't want to share

[Cutter Bay Kennels]

No......cutter, I was not calling you out at all ,sincerly curious. I have my ideas and way but they are pretty simplistic and was relly interested in details as to what
hat and how you did it....
and if how you do it your way only matters to you why did you jump in the thread if you don't want to share

Bryant,

I posted a thread so that this one would not get sidetracked.  

For the record, you are a moderator on here.  That is great.  There are a lot of us on here that are sarcastic.  Believe it or not, I am one of them.  
However, there seems to be an issue with certain moderators liking to belittle or test certain individuals, yet don't like to be brought front and center for it.  Strange.  

If I post it, I have no issues explaining my perspective for those who are truely curious as to my intentions.  However, I don't feel the need to share detailed explanations for those who themselves don't participate in such discussions.  Making a bold statement does not make the person right.  It just means they made a statement.  

[Cutter Bay Kennels]

I might add;

You must be honest with yourself, before you can be honest with others.   

Call a spade a spade.   

[BIG CHRIS]

No......cutter, I was not calling you out at all ,sincerly curious. I have my ideas and way but they are pretty simplistic and was relly interested in details as to what
hat and how you did it....
and if how you do it your way only matters to you why did you jump in the thread if you don't want to share

Bryant,

I posted a thread so that this one would not get sidetracked.  

For the record, you are a moderator on here.  That is great.  There are a lot of us on here that are sarcastic.  Believe it or not, I am one of them.  
However, there seems to be an issue with certain moderators liking to belittle or test certain individuals, yet don't like to be brought front and center for it.  Strange.  

If I post it, I have no issues explaining my perspective for those who are truely curious as to my intentions.  However, I don't feel the need to share detailed explanations for those who themselves don't participate in such discussions.  Making a bold statement does not make the person right.  It just means they made a statement.  

HMMMMMMM