Pettin dogs

[Purebreedcolt]

Hears my theory I give pups lots of attention etc up to about 4 or 5 months then after that I don't show them much attention at all till about a year or when ever I think they are ready for the woods I take them and make sure they have some handle and then it is to the woods.  No my dogs don't know no tricks but they know to come when called that is about it.  Besides what a pig is.  Now my cds get plenty.  I think is also has to do with the dogs your starting with.  If your dogs get out and hunt and you give them attention then you have a pup that grows up with these dogs I think that has a lot to do with that said pup going. Learn from example.

[Miller Lite]

my black mouths do what you just said they dont stick around me they know i gotta stick waitin for them  if they dont perform these dogs are also old enough to know what they are doing wrong an most the time i can scold them with words an never put a hand on them an you would think im killing them  ... i raise an train every dog i own an i play with every dog i own my 8 month old puppy ran with my big dogs  yesterday an bayed with them an that was 300lbs hog this is were genetics comes into play im very picky about which dogs get bred in my yard an what they are bred too only dogs that will get ahead on there own an find an bay hogs everytime i hunt them get bred i also cull very hard some say to hard but if you get to run with them yella dogs you understand why i cull i will not own a help dog all my dogs better be capeable of finding an baying there own pig or they dont not make the team i personally do not wanna have what people consider a help dog .. yes i do not mind if they honor another bay an help out an thats one hell of an oxymoron but  thats no problem but its not cause that dog wasn't tryin to find his own hog ... i've got a male right now that is insanely independent he WILL NOT hunt with another dog he does he own thing an is turning into a damn fine hog dog he is also a dog i put in the back of my truck an dare someone to mess with it i was always taught an told (YOU GOTTA BE SMARTER THEN THE DOG IF YOUR GOING TO OWN IT) when i was little that used to piss me off now im older an i see what they were talking about i've been huntin goin on 12 years now an i gotta few buddies who are new to the game an are not smarter then the dogs they own they think that they should be able to turn them loose as puppies an them dogs go find hogs ... wrong when i take just my puppies i feed them tracks yes i walk with them but them dogs are not near me they stay ahead i do not allow them to walk near or behind me i tell them to get ahead an make them stay ahead when they do right i praise them when they do wrong i scold them my animals will perform or they wont make it ... this is just a little bit about how i hunt not tryin to piss anyone off but thats just how i was raised to do things i know a lot of you fellas have been huntin longer then i've been alive an i respect that so again no offense intended but i do play with my dogs i do make them my best friend i teach them the basics they learn to lead load up an everything before i turn them onto hogs an it works for me but to each his own everyone has different styles an no one is always goin to agree but thats my little input on petting dogs ... works for me

[geronimo]

a good hunting dog can be well socialized...but when the tailgate drops he is all business and the range...he is born with it.

i tend to belive along these lines as well reuben, and this is gonna b an on going debate because there are 2 many variables that can change alot abt what someone belives abt this subject, depends on who u ask, but i know for a fact as well as others that have hunted with me that i spend alot of one on one time with my dogs and 2 of them will stay gone until u bay a hog, or catch them off, and another dog of mine wont hardly leave your feet unless u get in real hot sign, all these dogs hunt and r kennled together but just have different drive, but all of them have pretty good handle in my opinion

[M Bennet]

i dont mess around with mine only when i feed i might pet them. but when i go to the woods ill show more care towards them. but they have a job to do and if i needed a ride around dog i would get one. my dad had plotts when he guided in nm and i can rember as a kid he never plad with them. thats the way i do my dogs. my old retired dogs are my buddies and my famlie loves on them. i dont get to atached cause if we loose them it dont hurt me as bad.

[JeffreyTBH]

the more you pet and play fetch and go swimmin and wrestle and all that good stuff the better handle you will have on your dogs in the woods some of my best dogs ever were spoiled rotten house broke pets . but when the tail gate dropped it was all buissness .

Absolutely I had a plott that was raised w my neice. He would let her lay all over him and play w his ears. But as soon as I put his cut collar on he was meaning buisiness. He even foamed at the mouth when baying a hog!! He is cool!

[JeffreyTBH]

i tell you what the more you handle your dogs the better they are going to be every dog i have on my yard i trust to be around my kids they are rough but they know there limits hell my 65 pound rednose pitt catch dog might as well be a house dog and my kids can do anything to that big block head and he loves it but when you put that vest and collar on him he knows its show time i cant stand hunting with people that have dogs that they cant control you turn them loose and then you cant catch them every dog i have knows how to sit, lay, and stay and i catch hogs with them all the time.

well said i agree 100%

Absolutly 100% AGREE!!!!

[BarrNinja]

Sounds to me like some folks are getting confused with handle and petting/spoiling dogs. There is a big difference.
There is nothing wrong with a little affection and praise when a dog is doing something right but I think you cut range and hook off of any given dog by spoiling them and treating them like pets. Im not saying not to just sharing my opinion.
Ive owned some great dogs that where spoiled rotten. They would find a hog and bay it all day but I still think they would have been better dogs if they were not spoiled as a pet.
One would quite a bay, come find you and bark a few times as if to say "hey the hog is over here!" then refind the hog and bay it until we got there. The problem with that was that the hog didnt always stay where he left it.

I have to agree with Bryants comment but my hog dogs arent pets either. Yall do what you want to.

[uglydog]

I am wondering if you asked somebody why a certain dog does something particular ? and they gave you an answer and now you are asking on here to validate an opinion?

Quote from: Bryant on February 16, 2012, 11:42:34 am
Quote from: tomtom on February 16, 2012, 10:45:01 am
I don't agree that petting/handling affects drive.

I didn't say it affects drive, but I do believe it effects a dogs independance.  This is not something I just think...I have observed it MANY times over the years both with dogs I've raised (and screwed up) myself and pups from the same litters that go to people who handle them differently.

Think of it like this.  I know someone who seldom puts their catchdog on a lead.  They can walk the dog 20 yards from a bay, stand there looking at the hog and until the command is given that dog won't go.  Doesn't mean the dog is any less driven, just means it's been trained as such.  Now take a puppy and pet it, play with it and let it think it is okay and proper to stay near you for the first year of it's life.  Now at a year old you take same dog, drop it in the woods and guess what it does.  What you've done even unknowingly is train that dog to stay close.  Doesn't mean it's any less driven, just that it's been conditioned to act the way it is and not necessarily the dogs fault.  Now someone with enough patience may undo what has been accidentally done, but me personally I would rather just not create the issue than have to deal with it later.

As for having the wrong pups, I've seen VERY few good solid lines of dogs that consistantly have the go-yonder hunt that I require in my dogs yet almost any dog can be trained to handle.  I think I'll stick with the hunt.

Again, just my personal observations of what I've seen and done over the years.

It depends on the dog, some dogs can be petted to death and you wont stop then from going a mile deep but most folks will never have the fortune of ever hunting with a dog of that caliber much less owning that dog, so yes most dogs that are "BORN " with the bloodlines and drive and paid good money for, then grow up and petted on are "CONDITIONED" to stay close by and then the owner goes "I dont understand why it wont hunt"

I can verify from many years experience of working peoples dogs for them. getting paid to "train" dogs. I get dogs all the time, hunt great for me and go home and OWNER WONT/cant understand why their dog wont HUNT, they blame the dog. WHEN in fact its the owners FAULT 99.9 % of the time and I can take the dog and turn it around and get the dog hunting really nice again in a few weeks.

NOBODY WANTS to HEAR THAT THOUGH.

Sorry had to go and come back to this part-
I can also tell I have made all those mistakes and learned the hard way alot of the lessons coming from a background of "training" obedience dogs, thinking I could train my first dogs to do what I said and when, it took alot of dogs and eating crow to figure the hard lessons and ruin dogs to let the dogs BE DOGS, not pets, after the dogs are FINISHED, I can spoil them rotten, BELIEVE me I do, several have slept at my feet after they learned to consistently go out and hunt a year or two.
I still dont have the greatest dogs of my own, but dogs that are real capable and I give them all the best advantages. I have clients that much better dogs than my own at times, and many that never will own a good dog because the owner holds the dog back, not intentionally but with lack of knowledge. I what I do have is dogs that are

[Reuben]

part of the problem with petting the hunting dog could be timing...if the dog gets called in and then petted the dog could intepret this as a reward for staying by the handler and so he doesn't range out because he wants to please. not saying this is fact but a possibility that the dog is misunderstanding what we want from him. We see it as just petting the dog but the dog saw it in a different way...these type of situations happen more often than not...these are the little things that can make the dog excel to a higher level or could be the little things that sets him back.

When I see a dog that is out of control I can almost bet that the kids are out of control. And this to me is due to the lack of parenting skills...and chances are these parents are weak in dog handling skills as well.

one method to get a dog to range out is fairly easy if the dog has it in him. Take the dog straight from the kennel to the dog box and take him to the woods and turn him loose and get busy while ignoring the dog. The dog will get bored and with the stored up energy he will go off and explore.

So to me it is not so much the petting but how we train our dogs...

I do very little training...I just try to make the right calls at the right time.

if it works then I have a good dog, and if it don't... then he is a cull...

[Bryant]

A dog recognizing an owners alpha authority and having a good handle has NOTHING to do with being petted and played with.  In regards to handle, I can quickly thing of several cow dog men whose dogmanship I respect, that have some of the best handing dogs you can imagine and those same dogs seldom feel a human hand.  Putting a handle on a dog has everything to do with timing and conditioning,,,,and nothing to do with your play time.

[Bryant]

It depends on the dog, some dogs can be petted to death and you wont stop then from going a mile deep...

99.99999% of those dogs aren't pups.

[Reuben]

I have a pup right now that gets plenty of attention and gets petted often enough. If this pup does not make it then it is becuase he does not have it in him...but I am betting he makes at least a decent hogdog.

I do know that there is a "MINIMUM" amount of socializing that needs to go into a pup and petting is included. I also know I don't want an antisocial dog...

[reatj81]

My opinion, and we all no opinions are like a$$ holes, everyone has one,  My dogs are pets in the yard, and they are treated like working stock while hunting.  When we are going hunting they no its time to work, not play!  while hunting the only time I well pet them is if i can catch them after catching a hog before they roll over.  And at that point I make it a point to pet them a lil bit and tell them they did good!  Saying this each dog is so different, I have two litter mates, the male could care less if i ever touched him, and the gyp lives to be patted on the head and told good job!  I have never had a dog respond so much to praise!  I feel as if she lives to be praised, and it makes her try that much harder,  I dont no for sure but i bet if i gave her to someone who did not praise her, that she would not continue to hunt for them, but I could be wrong. and on the other hand I have had several dogs that were stand offish that after hunting them they became alot friendlier.  It gave them a bond to me, giving them a job!

[Reuben]

and on the other hand I have had several dogs that were stand offish that after hunting them they became alot friendlier.  It gave them a bond to me, giving them a job!

x2...


Also, as a little kid I had a few dogs that were not shy but did not like to be petted or handled.  one of these dogs would get two gentle pats on his side and I would just say good boy and that was it. any more than that and you got a low rumble from deep down in his chest. He was a good hunting dog and he was strictly business and kept to himself...

seems we always have different opinions but that is what makes the world go round and round...keeps it interesting

[tnhillbilly]

i dont mess around with mine only when i feed i might pet them. but when i go to the woods ill show more care towards them. but they have a job to do and if i needed a ride around dog i would get one. my dad had plotts when he guided in nm and i can rember as a kid he never plad with them. thats the way i do my dogs. my old retired dogs are my buddies and my famlie loves on them. i dont get to atached cause if we loose them it dont hurt me as bad.

I do mine the same

[dan]

 Dogs are tools to be mastered, and used. If it makes a person feel better to pet them then go ahead. Petting has nothing to do with working. Dogs don't think and reason the way humans do. Petting a dog does more good for the person than the dog.

[YELLOWBLACKMASK]

I agree "Hunting Dogs" are tools and to be utilized as such. When they are dull..put a blade on them and keep them oiled. Then put them back in the shop if your not utilizing them.

Pet em when they deserve it and earn it. Make them hunt for themselves not your attention or affection.

When they make it to retirement.....Spoil the hell out of em and pet everyday......they have earned it then.

Also it never fails when somebody loves their dogs so much and tragedy strikes....most people can't even finish the hunt due to their grief.  Love a Lab........they Arnt GLADIATORS! 

O yeah. JMO..