What does ?

[TexasHogDogs]

Now I ask the other question earlier what would you add to your pack of dogs are family of dogs like Grit , Nose , Winding Ability and so on.

Now I ask what does your pack of dogs do best .

Do they take a track better are wind better ?

[halfbreed]

  dang hard one , since i started the hound cur crosses they seem to be about 50/50 with it  .

[TexasHogDogs]

Yeah its a hard one Halfbreed it sure it.  I would have to say also 50/50 on mine .

[Reuben]

the dogs I have now lack in more than one area...

the pack I had at one time had good noses for trailing and long range winding...about as good a pack as any...but 2 things I would have improved on if I could...

1. a little less bark on track with some of them...

2. I loved the stick they had and they had plenty of grit...but  a little more inclination to stop the hog naturally instead of fighting the hog which busted bays...

[Curcross1987]

Ground

[Kid7]

Only thing I would change now would be grit. Not rough just when a hog runs hit it in the a$$

[Kid7]

I like the way they stand back and bay. But I want them to hit the nuts on one that runs. My lead dog is the only one I hav that doesn't hav a touch of hound. And she has a good nose

[Purebreedcolt]

I would add a dog that absoytly did not put a tooth on a hog so I coyld run rcds with it and npt wprry abput it getting cut down

[Lance]

My dogs have alot of bottom on a runner which is why I want more whoa! I'm tired of chasing hogs.

[reatj81]

My dogs have alot of bottom on a runner which is why I want more whoa! I'm tired of chasing hogs.

I'm with you Lance bottom is the last thing I need more of, if anything they have too much at times......I want more whoa also but I'm looking in a bit different direction than I believe most people are.... Earlier when I mentioned herding instinct I was also speaking of stopping ability.   Yes times have changed but I believe with more of the correct herding instinct it will also stop more running hogs.  I like a stock dog that will reach up catch a cow that breaks by the ear and stop her,  then back up bay her and allow her to return to the herd and bay and hold the entire herd.  These dogs work as a team complimenting each other.  They are not ruff, they don't pressure livestock, they don't bite or try to separate an individual,  but when needed they will catch like a bulldog and stop them.  They hold the stock in one place.   These dogs think and work as a team.

[Reuben]

the dogs I have now lack in more than one area...

the pack I had at one time had good noses for trailing and long range winding...about as good a pack as any...but 2 things I would have improved on if I could...

1. a little less bark on track with some of them...

2. I loved the stick they had and they had plenty of grit...but  a little more inclination to stop the hog naturally instead of fighting the hog which busted bays...

My dogs have alot of bottom on a runner which is why I want more whoa! I'm tired of chasing hogs.

I'm with you Lance bottom is the last thing I need more of, if anything they have too much at times......I want more whoa also but I'm looking in a bit different direction than I believe most people are.... Earlier when I mentioned herding instinct I was also speaking of stopping ability.   Yes times have changed but I believe with more of the correct herding instinct it will also stop more running hogs.  I like a stock dog that will reach up catch a cow that breaks by the ear and stop her,  then back up bay her and allow her to return to the herd and bay and hold the entire herd.  These dogs work as a team complimenting each other.  They are not ruff, they don't pressure livestock, they don't bite or try to separate an individual,  but when needed they will catch like a bulldog and stop them.  They hold the stock in one place.   These dogs think and work as a team.

you are saying exactly what I am saying...

[reatj81]

Reuben it is very difficult to put into words.

[TexasHogDogs]

This is were I differ for other folks and am not saying am right are ya ll are right but this is my ideal of what is going on and what I have seen .

The hogs are not like they use to be were you can circle and herd them like back in the day.  If you got a dog that is gonna reach out and grab a ear once he does it that hog is not going back in the pack and stand there and be bayed as cattle not this day and time ,  most the time he is gonna take off like a 747 and the rest that are with him is going to follow him are take off and break in all different directions hence there goes all the split bays if you can catch them again.  

If you got a head dog out in front of that big hog now a days most the time when the big hog has had enuff he is just gonna run you ass over and be gone and biting him on the ear is just gonna piss him off and here he goes  leaving dogs to chase him then he is going to run your dogs threw a slew of sows and pigs and hence once again here the dogs are getting separated and here we go again split bays and that is only if you can catch them and most the time it is not going to be the big bad boy you was on its gonna be a littler pig are a good sow and your bad boy hog you was on is gone laughing his ass off and just put another feather in his hat .

Now this is what has happened here with us I don't know about ya ll .

So I have come to the conclusion if my dog bites a ear he better have the balls to hang on to it and lets get the Rodeo on with every body else pile drivin his stinky butt not nip it turn it loose and think he is going back to the group and be bayed like cattle .  If my dogs lay teeth on a hogs frontend I want the son of a gun caught on the spot the backend is different .   What happens from my experience is the hog goes to the North Pole once teeth is laid on him from the frontend unless you have some very very very good

"ass eating machines which most do not " to hold him long enuff for a dog to get the ear and get lock jaw right there are dogs get both ears then he is stopped .

I just cannot see it myself ,  the day of herding hogs is over for the most part,  the day of the running bad ass fighting machines is here this is why so many people including myself have had so much trouble with running hogs.  In the back of my mind I want the hogs to be like they use to be and use the same methods as of old but in the front of my mind my eyes are telling me things are not the same change is needed hell you are seeing it why aint you believing it .

I don't say this to be a smart ass and I don't say it to think I know more than anybody on this board but got dang it my eyes do not lie to me and I speak only from what I see and have witness and had my hands on .  

The day of the herding is over for the most part sure you are going to have some that will but they are getting further and further away and evolving into just what we are seeing with our own eyes Running Fighting Long Winded Get Gone Kind of Hogs .  

[dblackwell]

Texashogdogs, what you just said I can agree w 100 persent. HOGS ARE NOT CATTLE!!!! Throw dogs to bad cattle and watch for 30 40 min an hr 2 hrs whatever it takes eventually they will settle and be face in butt out ready to pen. I have seen it time and time again. I cannot for the life of me understand how a circling hard baying dog will stop a runing hog once broke if he grabs ahold he better stay hooked and have help on the way or that hog will be in the next county before you know it.

[TexasHogDogs]

We can go a little bit futher in to this here .  Now I know people are going to say just take one are two bay loose baying dogs and the hog will stand with no pressure on him.

Yes I agree with this .

But things are also changing as far as this goes also .  I have done this a few times myself but here is were the problem is coming in with this .   You got your bay dog out there lets say two of them loose baying and the hog is standing but he is 250 yds inside the deep woods .  Now you are going to lead your catch dog into this and turn him loose from what about 25 yds are 50 .  Well what I have seen going on with this and have had it happen to us Brent and myself here not long ago and once with just Kyle and Me with just ole Blu baying this hog . First time,  At about 75 yds I tell Brent we cant walk in there if he hears us he is gone and if he winds us he is gone and this is Johnny on the spot folks the hog will be gone gone gone.  So we turn the catch dogs loose and what happens is this,  he let the catch dog almost get there and then rushed him head on went underneath him threw him ten foot in the air and cut the living hell out of his under side and took off with us running him the rest of the day with no hog.  This has happen more than once but this was a prime example of it here not to long ago . We ended up on a all day race and never got the hog .  Matter of fact this has now happened a couple of times and I think it was the same hog because we stuck him in the same place and he ran the same route out of there as he did before .  The  Second time with me and Kyle about the same sitituation he hears the catch dog and was just gone gone gone before he even got there this time .

Heres the catch .

Now the third I had Thomas, Kyle and WayOutWest with me had the Cracker dog and my main crew with us .  So I tell Thomas about the boar hog and we go to the same spot guess what they strike but this time all the ruff dogs were there as soon as they bark Thomas says Jimmy they are fighting they are caught right now lets go .  Thomas gets there first he sees it all the Cracker dog has a ear all the other dogs are hangin off the ass end and the catch dog Bo comes over the embankment and hits the other ear caught hog .  Of course I cant say its the same hog for sure for sure but it sure is funny he was stuck in the same exacte spot nearly all three times and ran the same route two times and was headed back in that direction when he ran into a mess of TRex'es.

[TexasHogDogs]

Texashogdogs, what you just said I can agree w 100 persent. HOGS ARE NOT CATTLE!!!! Throw dogs to bad cattle and watch for 30 40 min an hr 2 hrs whatever it takes eventually they will settle and be face in butt out ready to pen. I have seen it time and time again. I cannot for the life of me understand how a circling hard baying dog will stop a runing hog once broke if he grabs ahold he better stay hooked and have help on the way or that hog will be in the next county before you know it.

NAIL ON THE HEAD !

[jon]

My mt cur tracks better then winds nose to the ground constant and I would like to add a little more grit to her

[Reuben]

I had pretty rough dogs for a good while and this is how it goes...dogs work great in open woods...they pick up a track and move it and when they come up on a hog it was a caught hog...they let go and bayed and if the hog tried to run they caught again (big hogs)...key words are "open woods"...I am talking about 5 or 6 dogs...the reason these dogs could handle this big boar is because they had the size and smarts to keep it stopped and they didn't get cut because they were all right there and they could maneuver and work smart...

same scenario but thick woods...the dogs busted the bay more often than not because not all the dogs got there at the same time and they could not maneuver so the hog broke bay and ran some more...sometimes caught hog and sometimes not...

but once these dogs commit to a catch in tight places they usually had the hog but sometimes this was bad news for some of the dogs...usually happened when the dogs blew out the box and caught one right away...

in thick woods running one dog and sometimes 2 depending on iduvidual dogs the hogs might hold bay...but I liked running all my dogs and I liked running my dogs more than just catching hogs...don't get me wrong, I like catching hogs but not as much as running all my dogs...but...not catching hogs 2 or 3 times back to back about took the wind out of my sails... 

I wrestled with this problem since the late 1990's and it was always on my mind...I don't really care for stock dogs and I prefer lots of gritt...but lots of grit get dogs killed and I have had a few that didn't make it...If the next dogs get that way they will have running vests...there is a fine line between too much grit and not enough...but alot has to do with hunting terrain...open terrain and the dogs I had were perfect...thick thick woods and all the stars had to line up right to catch that boar hog with said dogs...but real rough dogs worked but here was the problem I saw with them....A friend bred the mt cur blood I used with a pit bull and the pups hunted hard and some never barked just caught...I saw one of those young dogs running by me in the real thick briars and all I saw was the briars shaking and a few grunts and when I got there the hog must of run off with the dog on his ear...this was back when we didn't have enough collars for all the dogs...but dogs hunting like this is not good...

I have seen that mt cur with pitbull is a good cross if you want hunt and catch...but these dogs might not make it long due to over heating or getting cut down...couple of these dogs will work just fine close up with garmin collars...but a mile out in the thick woods and it could get ugly...

when the scenario changes the type of dog needed changes...  and sometimes the scenario is the same but the hunting pressure changes and now the hogs have adapted to the change...

you get a loose baying dog in a place and you can walk right up making noise with 2 catch dogs and after 6 months with the same style and same dog the hogs will hold bay until they here someone coming...they have learned what that noise brings...

I never did come up with a solid answer on how to catch hogs for sure...I am always sure about everything I have posted on here from day one whether it be right or wrong...  ...but how much grit in my pack of dogs I have never been sure of...too much grit and we are talking about catch dogs and that could get real bad in a hurry...slightly less than that is probably what I would need but that there is a fine line to try and breed such a dog...

different hunting conditions require different type of hog dogs...but I do believe that rough dogs with lots of hunt and bottom will work more often than not as compared to other type of bay dogs...but this is my opinion...

[T-Bob Parker]

Yall act like hogs have evolved into a different animal entirely. Since we don't know eachother I don't wanna come across disrespectful or rude but I'll say that a good set of dogs with stock sence can still work these modern super hogs just fine and dandy and as far as hogs not respecting a stock dog after it breaks, I beg to differ. I can't get cocky and say "boy I'll show you" or nothin stupid like that, but I'll tell you I've seen about 20-30 boar hogs in the last several months who did break and run who my Ratty dog rolled with and bayed by herself.

She's no super dog or even much to brag about, that's not what I'm acting like, she's just got stock scence though and will lull them into chilling out. She don't hammer down and bay hard nose to nose like so many people on here describe. Haha as a matter of fact she don't do much "baying" at all! In reality, I'd never find her without a Garmin BECUASE she don't let out but a few lazy barks every now and then when the hog moves, the rest of the time she will get low and back up and just growl/ growlbark at a settled hog. I think that's sorta her secret. If they are calm she is calm if they wanna bolt, she will quietly talk to em and "dance with em"

I no I can say it with confidence BECUASE i done seen a bajillion times where I can go to her and as long as some other dog don't get off in there and screw it up, you can ease in to her LAYED ON HER BELLY and see a hog several yards in front of her ALSO LAYED ON HIS BELLY OR SEATED AND CHILLING!!!
You'd have to see what I'm talking about to understand, so that's why I'm not real big on talking serious topics on here anymore. People don't believ me so they either talk $&): or wanna have a pissing contest, I happen to think kindly of y'all who have responsed on this thread so far so that's why I even bother.

Anyway guys, if you think I'm full of it, that's fine, I've gotten used to it by now. But I will say I hunted with CWard a while back where every one of the hogs we cuaght was a runner and SOMEHOW??? Those stock bred loose baying dogs of his (one of them I keep) managed to catch 11 hogs in 4 hours?   

[T-Bob Parker]

Also, it should go without saying, but I'm not downing anybody else's style of dogs, i like rough rough rough, "catch that som beech" type dogs still too!!! Believe me, Josh Hefernan has one who may get outhunted, but she won't hardly ever get outrun

She bays to catch, I love her, she's a BAD BAD BITCH.

There see, not being prejudiced, not being mean.