I just don't understand.......

[MrsLouisianaHogDog]

I am just in awe, after watching this news story, and that officer's chest cam. I'm speechless.
What was he thinking? This should have been handled SO so differently. This is in no way a bash LEO post....I have family members that are in Law Enforcement. I respect their jobs, but this incident right here.....is just, sad. Deadly force was VERY MUCH uncalled for in this incident.....

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/cops-shoot-kill-mentally-ill-man/vi-BBioQd0?ocid=mailsignout

[rdjustham]

So many thins come to mind, however ill only make one point and ask three  questions.

1:  after all five (5) CNN anchors that were on at the time said on national tv that they stood with the protestors in both the furgeson and Ny deals and then all put their hands up I lost the little respect I had for them as "news" reporters.

Now for the questions,

Have you shown this video to your family who are in law enforcement? 
What was their take? 
Have any of them ever been attacked with a weapon?  (Yes a screwdriver can be a weapon)

[MrsLouisianaHogDog]

 I Understand that a screw driver can be a weapon. I didn't dispute that. What I am questioning, is being these officers had training in dealing with the mentally ill,  knowing the man was mentally ill, why in a matter of seconds the situation went straight to five shots that mortally wounded the man.....the man who was lying face down in his blood dying (whom they also handcuffed), and didn't immediately call for EMS. I've sent the videos to said  family members and am awaiting their insight for what it's worth. I obviously was not there, but I know what I saw on that video from the officers chest cam.
Again.........
I am NOT bashing LEO, I am simply questioning the way this particular incident was handled.

[charles]

miraculously the other officer's cam crapped out just before the shooting. with only that 1 cam working, it didn't show the guy "attacking" the officers. i personally don't think that was a clean shoot. at least 1 officer had a taser. so why did he not draw that instead of their weapons? i agree, it could have been handled differently. and this may be another reason why the feds are testing a new federal police force in the dfw area. ft worth agreed to receive funding from the government and be 1 of 6 other cities fielding federally activated police force.

putting myself in their shoes, both could have stepped back, 1 drawing his service peace and the other drawing his tazer. the tare could have been deployed before using deadly force. again, the only cam working didn't show the guy attacking, just the guy falling forward after being shot.


iv never been attacked with a screwdriver, but been attacked with a firearm, and i did return fire. a firearm or knife is much different than a blunt hand tool, which takes a lot more force and effort to cause lethal harm than a knife firearm.

 I'm sure its department discretion as to the level of "attack" for the officer/s to up the level of force, and left to the offices discretion, which i agree with. it should be left to the department and officer/s discretion to escalate the usage of force. but again, just from the cam, that specific incident could have been handled a little better, and dispatch should have provided them with more info, OR the communist news network should have provided a more in-depth/accurate description of the call from the hm owner to dispatch and dispatch to the officer. but as with most so called news reporting a-holes, they only show/tell what they want and what will get more ratings.

[Curcross1987]

From what I seen that is murder and the cops should be charged

[Shotgun wg]

I want to know why in the devil any city would agree to a federal police force in their city. There are enough federal agencies now. Why do our streets need patrolled by a federal police force. I'm not a doomsdayer but that makes me very concerned.


Shotgun
Arkansas

[Georgia-Hawgs]

I am not trash talking any officer's/deputies either. I have lots of friends and family that are in some sort of law enforcement. But there are tons and tons of videos online where i think to myself , "is this a bad / dangerous situation? " yep. "Did this person deserve to die? " hell no. I totally support the law and the folks enforcing it. God knows without them this would be a hell of a bad place to live. But i think there should be alot stricter restrictions as to when "deadly force" can be used. Like it was stated above. Deploy the taser first. And until the subject is endangering yours or someone elses life i simply dont think the use of deadly force can be justified. Now if someone "rushes" you and gets pretty dang close with the weapon then maybe its time to shoot. But i would have to take some leg shots first. I know alot of places teach that if the trigger is pulled its center mass or shoot to kill and all that. But i dont think it should be that way. Just as an example... if a fella rushes me with a screw driver in his hand , and ive already got a 40 caliber hand gun pointed in his direction i would be willing to bet a years pay that i would be able to take his legs out before he was able to get to me. Simple as that. Now you would have to be able to think clear enough to be able to know when the subject was to close and then comes the kill shots. I cant help but think about peoples families and things like that. I've never been in a situation like that and i pray that i never am. Even though i know for a fact i could take a life if i had to. It would ABSOLUTELY have to be the end of the line, last straw , bottom line , me or you type of situation. I'll shoot for the legs and maybe a gut shot and hope the medics can save your life when they get there, before i try to kill ya. Now a person with a gun is a totally different ball game. If the gun ever gets pointed in the wrong direction.... its over with. I didn't mean to ramble and go off track but i think sometimes people die for no reason.

[bjohnston0311]

I understand completely...don't make an advancement at a law enforcement officer giving you orders, especially when you have a weapon in your hand. Now Georgia, you would bet some money, but would you bet your life? Also, I seriously doubt they are trained to aim anywhere other than center mass. It would create another hazard with stray rounds considering you would be aiming at a 2-3 inch diameter moving target compared to a 12". It is not my concern to say "right" or "wrong", but I wouldn't risk my life on an individual with a weapon and unknown intentions.

[charles]

I want to know why in the devil any city would agree to a federal police force in their city. There are enough federal agencies now. Why do our streets need patrolled by a federal police force. I'm not a doomsdayer but that makes me very concerned.


Shotgun
Arkansas

The way i read it, the city police would be federalized, they would be the federal police force. Ill find the link n post it

[Georgia-Hawgs]

I understand completely...don't make an advancement at a law enforcement officer giving you orders, especially when you have a weapon in your hand. Now Georgia, you would bet some money, but would you bet your life? Also, I seriously doubt they are trained to aim anywhere other than center mass. It would create another hazard with stray rounds considering you would be aiming at a 2-3 inch diameter moving target compared to a 12". It is not my concern to say "right" or "wrong", but I wouldn't risk my life on an individual with a weapon and unknown intentions.

i never said anybody or any agency was trained to shoot anywhere but center mass. In fact i said thats where there trained to shoot at. All im saying is if the situatuon is right and a person can eliminate the threat without ending someones life it should be done that way. Now if theres a day care in the background and you cant afford to take some shots at the legs then that calls for a different action. But thats why i also said a man/woman should be able to think clear enough to make that decsion. If they cant think clear enough to make the right decision in situations they dont need to be out in the publice with a gun. That should be part of there training. And no i would never bet my life or anyone elses. Thats why i said you'd have to be smart enough to know when the person is to close. Then make your kill shots. The bottom line is you cant walk or run without your legs. If you have a screw driver , knife , stick, rock, or anything other than a gun i bet you wont get close to me before you hit the ground. STILL BREATHING

[bjohnston0311]

Everything is easier said than done no matter what training an individual has had. I have never served in civilian law enforcement, but I have been on a combat deployment and involved in some extremely delicate situations with "civilians" or "non combatants" the press likes to call them. More than too many times, there were situations when my mind did not agree with the rules of engagement and extensive amount of training. In a split second, life or death decisions have to be made and it is never easy....not the first time and not the last time. I think the same applies everywhere, whether it is law enforcement, a person defending themselves or their public property, or a security guard at the school trying to do a job. I'm glad he had the body camera on so we can give our opinions honestly with the details in the open. It makes it much easier to give an honest opinion instead of having to depend on undependable media or other forms of information. Please remember, this is all a personal opinion and I am not saying any other opinions are wrong. Sorry for the novel or any spelling errors....big fingers little phone. lol

[WayOutWest]

Shotgun, I'm with you! I see no reason that the feds come in and take over policing in city jurisdictions. It's one thing during a riot or a natural disaster but giving the feds control over day to day policing is BS. There are many issues I have with that! As far as this police shooting, I feel a lot of LEO's are blazing away way too quickly anymore. I understand that you think your life is at stake on every confrontation but some of the fellows doin this job are ill prepared in the quick thinking department. It's easier to blaze away and then say what you need to say to justify it. No offense to the LEO's who do there job with professionalism and good judgment but they are not all like that!

[rdjustham]

Hahaha knew all this was coming.  Bunch of people whi have never done the job miraculously know how from watching a video.  Go to the academy, train and put your a$$ on the line.  Then critique.  Because no doubt about it, crazy man less than 10 feet away with a screwdriver?  Every damn one of ya woulda done the same. 

[Fixitlouie]

Some cops are cool. Most not so much. Feel bad for all involved.  But hay lets film everything and see who a freek or not....im definitely a ass hole

[Curcross1987]

So it's ok if the police show up to your house and shoot you because you have a screw driver in your hand. There was two men against a mentally challenged person who could have been handled different . I'm tired of hearing people say you don't know how hard my job is if you are a coward the be a police officer is probably not a good choose

[rdjustham]

So it's ok if the police show up to your house and shoot you because you have a screw driver in your hand. [

Yeah it is, especially when you charge them with it.. 

quote author=Curcross1987 link=topic=90030.msg525954#msg525954 date=1426792905]
 There was two men against a mentally challenged person who could have been handled different .
[/quote]

Ummm.. Paranoid schizophrenia is not exactly down syndrome.  It makes people extremely violent and aggressive.  but hey you probably took the CIT classes too so you already knew that.

I'm tired of hearing people say you don't know how hard my job is if you are a coward the be a police officer is probably not a good choose

And what exactly do you do to contribute to your fellow man???  Why not go to the academy?  Scared, felon?  what? 

[MrsLouisianaHogDog]

Speaking for myself, I actually earned my degree in Criminal Justice because when I was younger, I aspired to be a Law Enforcement Officer. My goal was to work with a K9.
I went on plenty of ride alongs, had good mentors. Good guys.
Reason I am not a respectable LEO today is because of my unfortunate debilitating back problem.  Couldn't pass a physical. So I became a Vet Tech. I understand the whole brotherhood mentality, sticking up for each other come hell or high water, but each incident is its own, and circumstances vary. There's good folks out there, and bad folks out there, some don't wear uniforms, some do. In this particular incident, from what I can see from the video footage, how it was handled, was in my opinion uncalled for. We are all entitled to voice our opinions and draw conclusions from what we see. Obviously not every human is perfect, none in fact, So it surely is possible for someone wearing a uniform to make a poor decision. We've all made poor decisions in our lifetimes.

[Curcross1987]

So it's ok if the police show up to your house and shoot you because you have a screw driver in your hand. [

Yeah it is, especially when you charge them with it.. 

quote author=Curcross1987 link=topic=90030.msg525954#msg525954 date=1426792905]
 There was two men against a mentally challenged person who could have been handled different .

Ummm.. Paranoid schizophrenia is not exactly down syndrome.  It makes people extremely violent and


aggressive.  but hey you probably took the CIT classes too so you already knew that.


It don't pay enough for me and I probably would make a bad cop cause I don't do good with stupid crap but if you are going to do a job do it right

I'm tired of hearing people say you don't know how hard my job is if you are a coward the be a police officer is probably not a good choose

And what exactly do you do to contribute to your fellow man???  Why not go to the academy?  Scared, felon?  what? 
[/quote]

[rdjustham]

Speaking for myself, I actually earned my degree in Criminal Justice because when I was younger, I aspired to be a Law Enforcement Officer. My goal was to work with a K9.
I went on plenty of ride alongs, had good mentors. Good guys.
Reason I am not a respectable LEO today is because of my unfortunate debilitating back problem.  Couldn't pass a physical. So I became a Vet Tech. I understand the whole brotherhood mentality, sticking up for each other come hell or high water, but each incident is its own, and circumstances vary. There's good folks out there, and bad folks out there, some don't wear uniforms, some do. In this particular incident, from what I can see from the video footage, how it was handled, was in my opinion uncalled for. We are all entitled to voice our opinions and draw conclusions from what we see. Obviously not every human is perfect, none in fact, So it surely is possible for someone wearing a uniform to make a poor decision. We've all made poor decisions in our lifetimes.

No offense to you or your criminal justice degree, i have one too.  My sister has a masters in criminal justice.  You do know that degree is wortgless as tits on a boar hog right?  It isnt even close to what tge real world is.  Now with that being said, who is more than likely better versed in force on force?  A police officer who has to know state law, fed law and case law, or..... A vet tech with a criminal justuce degree?

Now add the fact the liberal ass hats at cnn probably deleted the other officers canera footage from theur brodcast because it didnt fut their agenda.  But lets cover wgat we did see.....

1st man wuth screw driver INSIDE front door. 
2nd cops yell drop it.
3rd you see same armed man shot aprox 2-3 feet outside front door.

So let us as reasonable humans surmise this, the man advanced (since we dont have the other video, we dint know if he walked ran crawled it skipped. But he cane forward.). Towardsthe officers armed.  There fore the officers did what??  They defended themselves.  Now coulle other things.  How narrow was the walkway?  They turned sideways to get through.  Where was the car parked?  Against the garage.  Where did mon immediately go?  Behind the officers for protection. 

im not supporting anyone, however this video and a little commib sense tells me its probably a good shoot.  However id be willing to bed the other officers film proves it and thats why liberal cnn didnt show it. 

Sorry bout the typos.  Hate typing on a phone.

[rdjustham]

So it's ok if the police show up to your house and shoot you because you have a screw driver in your hand. [

Yeah it is, especially when you charge them with it.. 

quote author=Curcross1987 link=topic=90030.msg525954#msg525954 date=1426792905]
 There was two men against a mentally challenged person who could have been handled different .

Ummm.. Paranoid schizophrenia is not exactly down syndrome.  It makes people extremely violent and


aggressive.  but hey you probably took the CIT classes too so you already knew that.


It don't pay enough for me and I probably would make a bad cop cause I don't do good with stupid crap but if you are going to do a job do it right

I'm tired of hearing people say you don't know how hard my job is if you are a coward the be a police officer is probably not a good choose

And what exactly do you do to contribute to your fellow man???  Why not go to the academy?  Scared, felon?  what? 

[/quote]

Doesnt pay enough?  But its such an easy job, its almost like stealing!  Dont have to rish your life or nothing!!  Its no where near as dangerous as being a monday morning quaterback!!!