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Author Topic: Training Tips  (Read 5007 times)
Jason Dunn
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« on: January 23, 2018, 02:47:26 am »

I was thinking on how I handle my dogs and want to start a thread to see how others go about their training I am no expert and don't consider myself a trainer hopefully I will learn something here. I don't mess with my pups much in the beginning pet them now and then try to let them run as much as possible. When they get about 6 months old I put them on a chain they bounce around like a fish on a yoyo for a while but after a week or two they lead pretty good. At around 7 months I start hauling them on the Ranger when ever I can. On the first few hunts I like to turn them in when the big dogs bay back before the crap laws passed in AR I kept and old sow in an acre pen to show them their first hog but cant do that anymore so they learn to bay in the woods. After they start baying good in the woods I will put them down with the big dogs when I find good fresh sign if the pup comes back to me I don't let it hand around if I cant get it to go back and hunt I load it up and this I think is important most of the time they don't want back in that box. If the big dogs strike once again I will turn the pup out. I try not to road hunt pups much I want to put them on hogs as best I can until they understand when they get out of the box its to find a hog I have seen guys let there dogs road hunt all day and hardly ever pick them up when they hang around or follow the ATV and they don't seem to work out. My dogs always hunt out the best on the firsts cast after 3 or 4 cast they usually make about 300-500 loop if they don't find anything they will come back I have learned if I think there is a hog in the area sit tight and they will go back out and they will go deeper the longer I sit the deeper they get now the pups may come back and want to hang out if so once again I load them up and if the big dogs bay turn them out. After the pups around a year and a half I kind of got a good idea what I have and honestly I dont like to keep trying to polish a turd I will normally hang onto a questionable dog until it 2 as long as its trying I have been trying to breed my own the last 5 or 6 years and one thing I do want is dogs that start early and move away from the late bloomers .
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Shotgun66
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« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2018, 05:22:54 pm »

Mr.Dunn, Your description of how you handle your dogs sounds like you are doing a good job of exposing a young dog to the right way to be a free casting find/bay dog. I particularly appreciate your patient approach to not letting them just hang around and do nothing. I try to wait for them to be mentally and physically ready to handle getting cut or thrown out of a race before I put them in the woods. I also like to start them with just one older dog I can trust and know very well. I make a concerted effort to keep their first few hunts short and pretty much drop them into hogs. From that point, I watch how they react and go from there. The hardest part for me is leaving them at home when they need to be hunted but are not ready for the circumstances a hunt might present them with. I have learned that being patient and letting them grow up and learn typically yields the best results for me.


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Leon Keys
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« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2018, 04:27:56 am »

I agree with both of  you...
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Training dogs is not about quantity, it's more about timing, the right situations, and proper guidance...After that it's up to the dog...
A hunting dog is born not made...
Jason Dunn
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« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2018, 12:27:32 pm »

My brother has a young dog that bays good but he isn't hunting like he should I have his sister and she is turning out real good. My brother like me will load him up but he still isn't hunting out he will make a small loop and come back hang out which burns my brother up we have tried getting on him to move out but that just makes him crawl under the buggy lol. We have toyed with the idea of casting him and bumping him with the shock collar to get him away from the buggy but were not sure if that will cause more harm than good but if he keeps it up he may end up as fertilizer dogs been hunted a good bit and at a year and a half old was showing good potential but the last few hunts hes been going backwards. I have seen dominant dogs that were aggressive make a young dog go back to the buggy for protection but this isn't the case I haven't found a good remedy for this yet hes 2 1/2 now not all dogs make it but like I said he was showing potential. I have a buddy he got a dog off a dude that will knock you down when he turns him out and he said the guy he got him from trained him that way with an e collar said he would lite him up to get him gone and he does get gone . 
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Mike
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« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2018, 12:32:00 pm »

I think the shock collar may do more harm than good in that situation... he may get gone, but not gone hunting. The dog may also be going through a lull... I've seen a lot of young ones go through spells like that for a while and then turn back on. It's just how much time and patience the owner has haha.
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Judge peel
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« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2018, 01:01:28 pm »

Patience and understanding are virtues most don't have. Mike I agree on the shock collar got to be careful. Just because a dog is far out don't mean it's hunting lot of times it has learned just to stay away from the handler. One thing I do that most don't is handle and spend as much time that I can with a pup. It might shorten there range but you end up know the dog better


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Jason Dunn
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« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2018, 04:19:36 pm »

Guys I am with you but as a last option it might be worth trying the sucker sure wont find one at the atv my brothers a little more patient than me hes been packing him around hope its just from laying up over deer season. I was wondering about the e-collar thing it sounds a little iffy .
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jdt
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« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2018, 06:32:21 pm »

i might be considered  fairly lazy . but but i just feed'em until they get old enough to haul , try 'em out several times and then i cull from there .
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Shotgun66
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« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2018, 07:02:00 pm »

Does he go to the other dogs when they strike or bay? You probably have some good lead strike dogs that normally find the hogs. Young dogs realize they don’t have to hunt. They just kick back till the other dogs strike. If this is the case, try to not hunt him with lead dogs that always strike. You could also try leaving him at home when you hunt. Sometimes, they don’t like being left out and hunt better when they get to go. Just a couple ideas to try. To your point, some just don’t make the cut. I try to give them every chance to succeed so I have no guilt when they don’t make it.


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Leon Keys
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« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2018, 07:47:09 pm »

Jason I agree except if I put a dog in the box for wanting to hang out, that's where he stays. I don't want him to think he can hang out or ride until something else locates or gets it stopped. If he wants to whisper sweet nothings in Miss Piggie's ear then he better be trying to be the first one to her to tell her, not sitting back and voluntarily letting the other guys ask her to dance first. I was also taught not to hunt a pup in an uncontrolled situation until one year old. Just because they can physically keep up doesn't mean that they can mentally handle some of the things that could be thrown at them. Had I understood this sooner, I might not have ruined several different pups in several different ways. As for the young dog that shut down, I agree with shotgun. Try putting him in hot hot sign and leave your lead dog at home. Just because the lead dog isn't aggressive towards him, doesn't mean that he isn't the reason for him not hunting. We went through areal similar situation. We started leaving the lead dog at home and putting the young dog in the lead role. We took other dogs but nothing above his pay grade so to speak. In nothing flat he was turning the crank. When we started trying to hunt the lead dog with him again, he shut down again. We gave him and another dog that wasn't as far along but started to a young hunter. The dog made a hand, a real nice kind of dog. I think it's a competitive thing. He realizes he isn't going to beat the older dog to the hogs so he developed that screw it, I can't beat him so I'm not even going try attitude. Myself, when I know my dog has a good idea of why he's in the woods, I start casting them first. I they struggle too long or when they locate I send help.
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Jason Dunn
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« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2018, 02:18:01 pm »

The dog does honor a bay and sticks good I agree he may be just saying screw it and hanging around for a bay we may try by himself see what happens.
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E barnes
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« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2018, 05:42:49 pm »

You can’t hunt Hunt into one it has to be bred in there. Just because it’s bred in there doesn’t mean they are all going to make it. Like Mike says I have seen a many of pup go through a lul around 2 but he should have showed you something before.


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Jason Dunn
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« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2018, 08:41:04 pm »

You can’t hunt Hunt into one it has to be bred in there. Just because it’s bred in there doesn’t mean they are all going to make it. Like Mike says I have seen a many of pup go through a lul around 2 but he should have showed you something before.

I agree Ed the little dog was looking good at 1 1/2 I been scratching my head trying to help my brother get him lined out right now his plan is to hunt him a little longer see how he goes.

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Goose87
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« Reply #13 on: January 26, 2018, 06:37:44 pm »

With situations like this here's something that has worked a good deal for me, I have tried a lot of different approaches, some have worked and some haven't and I've ruined good prospects and this method has worked more times than none, when he comes back don't put him up, instead tie him to a stationary object in a position where he can't sit down at all or get even remotely comfortable, to the point that if he tries to sit down or sit back he  nearly chokes himself, might have to even put a rope around his flank to help out and hold him completely up where he is completely standing up at all time, fix him to where he can't get himself into any harm and go on about your business, get him used to a bark collar and put a bark collar on him and leave him there if you need to leave to get to other dogs, just make sure the sun won't change directions and be beaming on him or he can't get tangled or anything, after a few times of this he will realize it's more comfortable and convenient to be gone, by putting him back up your doing what he wants to do and he knows he can lay down and be comfortable, by doing this he won't associate you or a shock collar with pain and fear, may take a few times but he will eventually learn that coming back isn't going to lead to any type of pleasure or comfort, I'd try this before shocking him to hunt, not trying to sound like a smart ass but that method wouldn't even be an option of last resort for me, shock collars are an absolute game changer and is actually our way of communicating with our dogs when they are out of ear shot, if the dogs done what he supposed to before and other family members are doing it then it's in him somewhere it's up to y'all to figure out the most efficient way of getting it to surface, then again a 5 hp Briggs and Stratton engine will never be 350 vortec no matter the amount of work done to it....
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BA-IV
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« Reply #14 on: January 26, 2018, 08:27:21 pm »

i might be considered  fairly lazy . but but i just feed'em until they get old enough to haul , try 'em out several times and then i cull from there .

This is about what I do. To me I don’t want to beg a dog to do it’s job and I’m inclined to believe most things are hereditary. That said, if he don’t start easy or natural, I don’t want him or her bred, and I don’t wanna keep much that isn’t breed worthy.
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Reuben
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« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2018, 03:24:18 am »

i might be considered  fairly lazy . but but i just feed'em until they get old enough to haul , try 'em out several times and then i cull from there .

This is about what I do. To me I don’t want to beg a dog to do it’s job and I’m inclined to believe most things are hereditary. That said, if he don’t start easy or natural, I don’t want him or her bred, and I don’t wanna keep much that isn’t breed worthy.

I agree...my yard is too small to have a dog that needs lots of tracks to make a Hog dog...sometimes early in a breeding program we have to lower our standards or if we are short on dogs...but the dogs that have the breeding and the hunt that take to hunting like a duckling takes to water are the kind I like to keep...the naturals

However, I do invest some time in the pups...
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Training dogs is not about quantity, it's more about timing, the right situations, and proper guidance...After that it's up to the dog...
A hunting dog is born not made...
Jason Dunn
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« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2018, 11:47:58 am »

I think sometimes we raise a dog and get wrapped up in it I got no problems culling but he will .
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Jason Dunn
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« Reply #17 on: May 07, 2018, 10:09:10 pm »

Update on Brothers dog

We were hunting the other day and as we rode to a feeder me and Brother had a discussion on the fate of Ole Bubba dog we both agreed he started off strong but over the past few months he had declined and wasn't making the cut I said I know you raised him and are attached but I would handle the culling if he wanted to leave him at the house he reluctantly agreed it was probably best because he had only room for a couple of dogs. We pull up at the feeder and toss out 3 dogs my gyp that I think a lot of an older gyp that's solid and Bubba I could see hog tracks around the feeder so we sat and waited dogs were running around everywhere in and out of the thickets the two gyps peeled out went down in the bottom but Bubba stayed in the thicket a few minutes passed and Bubba blew up I couldn't believe it and figured he was trashing cause the gyps left that spot I didn't want to fight the briars to go see the possum he had in a hole but we did and I be danged he had a sow bayed we caught her she had a huge nest with new born pigs inside so he lived to hunt another day. Next we went to a farm got into a group of 15lb pigs caught 2 chased another big hog into the back water he hunted as good as the others. Last week took him to another spot pigs had rooted down the road casted him by himself he went out a couple hundred hard came back put down a younger gyp they went out 400 yards split up he bayed little gyp joined in once again im thinking trash but then a hog crossed the trail with bubba a few minutes behind we was hunting at night so I was happy we never got the hog they would bay and run bay and run finally they got into the back water and eventually swam back out and went to back tracking didn't want to stop it was midnight and had a busy day planned so called it a night. I have to say we don't usually let one go this long like I said earlier not in the polishing turd business but in this instance it may work out we shall see. I told my brother he must have been listening to our culling conversation haha.
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Mike
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« Reply #18 on: May 08, 2018, 07:04:09 am »

Good deal... y’all may need to rename him Lucky haha.


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parker49
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« Reply #19 on: May 08, 2018, 08:38:08 am »

some dogs like a hog and  if you can get em out there they'll make a dog ....... but they also like to hang around the buggy too ...... sometimes  it takes  foot on head and  limb on a$$ .......  all you gotta have  is a dog that likes a hog and  will stay bayed i can put him out there ...
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