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Mike
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« on: April 20, 2019, 04:59:57 pm » |
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For those of you who line breed your dogs, how tight do you get before you outcross? I have a litter due in about a week that in my opinion is bred pretty tight. If they don’t come out with two heads, three tails, six legs and dumb as a rock... it may be time to outcross down the road.  |
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Goose87
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« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2019, 06:55:30 pm » |
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Was the poncho dog any Kin to them
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Mike
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« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2019, 06:56:58 pm » |
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No sir... he’s the only branch on the tree haha.
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bigo
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« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2019, 08:04:46 pm » |
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Too tight is when it quits working.
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The older I get, the better I was.
If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principle difference between a dog and a man.
Mark Twain
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t-dog
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« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2019, 08:36:32 pm » |
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How similar are the hunter and molly dogs to each other? How similar is poncho to the dogs you bred him into? I'm with bigo, on his theory, it's too tight when it quits working.
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Cajun
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« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2019, 08:49:55 pm » |
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What Bigo said. When your dogs start reverting back to average or not quite up to Par, Time for a outcross.
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Bayou Cajun Plotts
Happiness is a empty dogbox
Relentless pursuit
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Reuben
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« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2019, 09:23:09 pm » |
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Smaller litters...smaller dogs...smaller cahones...those are signs...
Keep it safe...if someone already has a really good young dog that has your blood on one side and the other side is not related but a lot like your dogs and he and his littermates were fairly uniform then that would be a green light to go forward with it...if the pups act and look right then more than likely it will be a good cross...
The hard part in my opinion is when your dogs are about the way you like them and you feel it is time to bring in new blood...
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Training dogs is not about quantity, it's more about timing, the right situations, and proper guidance...After that it's up to the dog...
A hunting dog is born not made...
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The Old Man
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« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2019, 11:09:29 pm » |
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The proof is in the puddin, if the puddin is still good the recipe is still good haha.
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Austesus
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« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2019, 09:53:13 am » |
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Following
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Trying to raise better dogs than yesterday.
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Mike
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« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2019, 01:33:17 pm » |
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So far the recipe is still good... this litter should tell the tale.
Reuben, there’s several 25-50% related dogs out there that I can cross back to. That would be my plan when I do... I don’t think I’ll ever make a 100% outcross.
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Mike
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« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2019, 01:43:37 pm » |
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T-dog, I don’t know anything about the Pancho dog. The Pancho/ Brandy cross was made back in 2008 by a friend of mine who owned Brandy. Pancho was a 3/4 cur 1/4 plott that was from out west in the Davis Mountains. The 5 pups that we raised all made good dogs... Hunter being one of the best ever out of these dogs in my opinion. It’s hard to compare Hunter and Molly, they were littermates, but she was ran over and crippled at a young age. She is a producer and has been passed around over the years as a brood gyp and produced good dogs no matter what she was bred to. When Jameson up in Oklahoma ended up with her, we bred her twice to my old Jase dog, a Hunter son, with the majority of each litter making good dogs.
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Austesus
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« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2019, 05:58:00 pm » |
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Mike, what are your dogs bred from? Is the Cur side black mouths? Are you dogs silent, or open? Loose, or rough?
Seems like you have an awesome breeding program in place
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Trying to raise better dogs than yesterday.
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Mike
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« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2019, 06:16:47 pm » |
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Austesus, all my dogs go back to the Tweety/Winchester cross. Tweety was a black catahoula gyp out of cow dog stock from Louisiana. Winchester was a brindle cur dog from some local East Texas blood here around Coldspring. I breed more to the Tweety side... which is the reason for the mother/son cross on her and Obama. All the Tweety/Winchester pups were Tweety clones in every way. This coming litter will go back to her 7 times, which is the direction I’ve been slowing heading towards for the past 10 years.
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t-dog
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« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2019, 07:40:08 pm » |
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Sounds like the right plan to me. This good producers are rare. When you find one you gotta do just what you're doing in my opinion.
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Austesus
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« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2019, 07:56:34 pm » |
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That’s awesome Mike. What was your reason for going back to tweety primarily instead of Winchester? Was she a better dog, just had different traits you wanted, etc..?
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Trying to raise better dogs than yesterday.
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Goose87
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« Reply #15 on: April 21, 2019, 08:55:48 pm » |
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My Little Girl dog is to me what Tweety was to you, and is the catalyst of the future of my breeding program...
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Goose87
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« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2019, 09:23:52 pm » |
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Mike I hope you don't mind, I entered this pedigree into my software on my laptop out of curiosity, it only goes back 4 generations, so without the tweety/Winchester blood being factored in the COI (coefficient of inbreeding) is 26.5625%. The COR, which is "coefficient of relationship" for tweety alone is 38.8889% without figuring in the tweety/ Winchester cross behind Obama...   Hopefully you can see these, definitely going to have to zoom in... |
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Austesus
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« Reply #17 on: April 22, 2019, 06:40:17 am » |
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What software is that goose?
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Trying to raise better dogs than yesterday.
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Mike
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« Reply #18 on: April 22, 2019, 10:10:44 am » |
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So if it went back another generation, I’m assuming the COI would be a lot higher? From what I’ve read, 25% or higher is pretty tight.
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Goose87
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« Reply #19 on: April 22, 2019, 11:24:05 am » |
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So if it went back another generation, I’m assuming the COI would be a lot higher? From what I’ve read, 25% or higher is pretty tight.
From what I understand about the COI's which isn't much you'd be even tighter, maybe if there's someone on here that has a good understanding about them will chime in... |
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