Only the strong Survive

[Txhoghunter]

No, you heard about ONE place I hunt Mike     These hogs around the house get dogged A LOT, as bad as anywhere. They may run, but they dont outrun.  Ive been to east tx, south tx, and Ok. Surely I would run across some of these super runners along the way?

[WestTexasCurs]

I also think we are dealing with way different hogs than in the old days.Now,I aint saying my dogs are better.But I would love to see someone come gather these hogs,and drive them to a pen.Maybe I'm way wrong.But I dont see it happening.  

[Txhoghunter]

I also think we are dealing with way different hogs than in the old days.Now,I aint saying my dogs are better.But I would love to see someone come gather these hogs,and drive them to a pen.Maybe I'm way wrong.But I dont see it happening.  

These hogs now days havent ever been to a pen. Kind of like cattle that are used to being penned in the same place and are horse/dog broke vs cows that havent ever even seen a horse/dog or pen I guess.

[LionandBoarHunter]

No, you heard about ONE place I hunt Mike     These hogs around the house get dogged A LOT, as bad as anywhere. They may run, but they dont outrun.  Ive been to east tx, south tx, and Ok. Surely I would run across some of these super runners along the way?

I HAV A FEW PLACES THAT MIGHT SUPRISE YOU THESE HOGS UP HERE IN THE HILLS ARE BUILT TO RUN AND THEY RUN LIKE A HELL  

[WestTexasCurs]

They are sorta wild nowadays compared to yesteryear.Maybe? I dont know.You sure would have a time trying to pen em.

[Mike]

Another story that relates to this. This was told to me by an old time hog hunter that has been hunting longer than most on here have been living... about 8 years ago. The hogs they hunted around here 15 years previous to that time, could be bayed in large groups and worked... all day everyday. Then they brought in a few loads of heavily "russian" influenced hogs from South Texas. Within a few years, all the good hogs were gone and nothing was left but these runners... evolution, adaptation, genetics???

I even heard a similar story just this past year from a fella with a ranch up in Oklahoma.

[Txhoghunter]

Im not going to get into a pissing match about whose hogs run further. A hog is a hog.  I hunt where theres a ton of pressure and where there is almost none...some run some dont. Simple.   

[WestTexasCurs]

I am pretty lucky to live in a part of the country that aint dogged heavy.So I am in no way saying these run more than others.Kinda like you said,they aint never seen a pen.And sure aint dog broke.All I'm saying is they are a different animal than what they were 50 years ago.My problem is we dont have enough hogs.

[BIG BEN]

   Why are the hogs more educated now and running more than they were 15yrs ago? Hunting pressure? Style of the dogs? More people hunting them? who knows some run some dont, some fight some dont.
  I can see were this is going to end up again, a russian blood arguement. This topic needs some ole timers to chime in and give there opinion on the subject.

[Lone Star 88]

Yes there getting smarter. Alot of people on here talk about catching those running hogs. You get your butt and nuts chewed on and you will learn fast to. Few weeks back when the bees got after us it was every body for them self. You didn't have to be getting stung, i was letting every body know they didn't want to be. 7 times on the head and 3 times on the back running like a little girl. Left the tiger tide to a tree getting his a$$ tore up to.

[Dexter]

 A thought
 someone said  evolution in hog takes 1000's of years,, I am going to have to make a point think about how domesticated hogs have changed in the last 30 years
       my .02
 Dexter

[DangerZone]

seems like to me as fast as the breeding cycle is for hogs it could change fairly quick....It doesn't take 50yr's to come up with a dog line thats more catchy or leggy .... cross your pit and curr dog ..line breed a few times and you'll have a leggy dog with a big head and jaws...it may not be a jam up dog and dumb as a brick but they will be different.....JMO  Danny Ward

[cantexduck]

A thought
 someone said  evolution in hog takes 1000's of years,, I am going to have to make a point think about how domesticated hogs have changed in the last 30 years
       my .02
 Dexter

  I dont think that is even in the same class. We influrenced the breeding of the domesticated hog for what we wanted, the animal didnt do it on its own.

[levibarcus]

I know where I'm at I have caught hogs that are short and thick, and some that look like a grey hound. I've often wondered how hogs can be so different in the same area. That being said, I have only run into one hog that I know has run and I haven't seen him yet. I've bayed him three times and he does the same thing every time. He will bay for one or two dogs that don't put too much pressure on him but when he sees the cd coming he breaks and RUNS. I figure that he has been dogged before and if he hasn't he is well educated now!lol That's just my experience, I'm not saying I have it figured out, I'm just all ears listening to ya'll! I have been thinking of turning a good domestic boar or two loose on my place to improve the quality of the hogs around here and add some color to them.

[Hog Dog Mike]

Years ago I had a big place leased in west Texas for bird hunting. It was a good place and was in shinnery country. We always had birds that would run but not that bad. I killed all the birds that would hold and the runners were the ones left. In a period of 10 years or less the birds on that place were bad to run. Also they learned to get up wild way ahead of the dog.

We had one covey we named "the smart covey" that we actually had to develop plans on how we were going to get them pointed. A few of them got killed but not that many because they were just too smart. Also I had better dogs as time went along.

A hog is a real smart animal and it does not take them that long to figure out how the deal works. One time we caught a big hog and put it in a bay pen. We had a pen for the hogs and a chute with gillotene gates leading to the bay pen. This hog went through the chute 1 time before he went to the bay pen. When he got tired of the dogs he ran right back to the gate he came out of and flipped it up with his snout. Then he proceeded to flip up every gate until he got back with the rest of the hogs.

Are you going to try and tell me that a hog that smart is not going to figure out that he needs to "get out of Dodge" when he hears man and dogs coming.

[catchdog7469]

I do think most dogs these days lack the bottom to stick with a hog. which leaves the question are they getting out run or just quiting which it a different subject all together. That being said I have been fortunate to own and hunt behind some nice dogs that come up with pork consistantly it just seems like it takes them longer to get them bayed. in my mind if a dog sticks with a hog long enough the hog will stop and bay. I am not rule'n out the education they are gettin from being run and not caught. Which could result in the if I run fast enough for long enough I can shake em. What I was refering to in evolving was the fact that the hogs I have caught in the past few years do seem to have more leg under them and are built to run.

[BarrNinja]

http://www.easttexashogdoggers.com/forum/index.php?topic=4829.0

This is an old thread that covers the same subject.

My post from over a year ago.

Great point Wmwendler .
I dont even know most of the hog hunters in my area these days and I see them everywhere!

Im putting these hogs in the same category with coyotes and whitetail deer myself. I agree with Wmwendler that they are adapting through learned behavior mostly and they are dang good at it! Same as coyote and deer.
But there is something else thats happening out there in the woods and Mike hits on it with his question " You notice the legs on some of these hogs these days?".
Thats how these hogs are evolving!
In the wild its always been survival of the fittest and these hogs are simply adapting and evolving like other species according to habitat and predator base. More specifically, us hog hunters.
 
My point is simple. With increased hunting pressure from all of the "pro hog hunters"  these hogs are learning that if they run fast and fare enough they can make a get a way! The ones that make that get a way (usually the more leggy ones) are the ones that continue to reproduce making more leggy little running sob's.
Its not happening over night but if man can bread a dachshund with 3 inch legs to work in badger hole then why cant mother nature bread a leggy hog to run like a race horse enabling it to get away from its predators given a little time.
Natures way of selective breading to accommodate a hogs predator base. Hog hunters!
Just my theory but it makes since to me.

Mike, I agree that its gonna get worse but we will always be able to catch them with dogs. Us predators adapt and evolve with our quarry also.

[DangerZone]

http://www.easttexashogdoggers.com/forum/index.php?topic=4829.0

This is an old thread that covers the same subject.

My post from over a year ago.

Great point Wmwendler .
I dont even know most of the hog hunters in my area these days and I see them everywhere!

Im putting these hogs in the same category with coyotes and whitetail deer myself. I agree with Wmwendler that they are adapting through learned behavior mostly and they are dang good at it! Same as coyote and deer.
But there is something else thats happening out there in the woods and Mike hits on it with his question " You notice the legs on some of these hogs these days?".
Thats how these hogs are evolving!
In the wild its always been survival of the fittest and these hogs are simply adapting and evolving like other species according to habitat and predator base. More specifically, us hog hunters.
 
My point is simple. With increased hunting pressure from all of the "pro hog hunters"  these hogs are learning that if they run fast and fare enough they can make a get a way! The ones that make that get a way (usually the more leggy ones) are the ones that continue to reproduce making more leggy little running sob's.
Its not happening over night but if man can bread a dachshund with 3 inch legs to work in badger hole then why cant mother nature bread a leggy hog to run like a race horse enabling it to get away from its predators given a little time.
Natures way of selective breading to accommodate a hogs predator base. Hog hunters!
Just my theory but it makes since to me.

Mike, I agree that its gonna get worse but we will always be able to catch them with dogs. Us predators adapt and evolve with our quarry also.

X2.....

[Mike]

Check out the running gear on this hog. He caught on the same river bottom that Matt_Aggie's Grandpa hunted hogs in 50 years ago.

[LionandBoarHunter]

Check out the running gear on this hog. He caught on the same river bottom that Matt_Aggie's Grandpa hunted hogs in 50 years ago.

mike we are not geting in a pissin match on who's hogs legs are longer